DIY_EFI Digest Saturday, 14 June 1997 Volume 02 : Number 201 In this issue: RE: bhp RE: Re[3]: bhp plugs & hp increases Re: bhp Bosh platinums track record RE: plugs & hp increases RE: bhp 700R4 ratios RE: bhp RE: Hydrualic pressure to HP formula RE: Hydrualic pressure to HP formula Re: Diy_Efi for '49-53 Ford Flathead O2 sensor meter See the end of the digest for information on subscribing to the DIY_EFI or DIY_EFI-Digest mailing lists. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Andrew Rabbitt Date: Fri, 13 Jun 1997 09:50:45 +0100 Subject: RE: bhp > Sometimes something a lot less awesome than a Merlin. Several > thousand miles ago I changed from Bosch Platinum plugs to Motorcraft. > > My 2.3l Turbo Coupe motor LOVED 'em! I must have picked up 25 hp. > My guess is that the Bosch plugs were misfiring enough to screw up my > a/f ratios but not enough to detect in the seat-o-pants dyno. > I'm afraid that if you can't detect a misfire with your seat-of-the-pants dyno, I fail to believe you can measure 25hp with the same device! ------------------------------ From: Andrew Rabbitt Date: Thu, 12 Jun 1997 14:23:17 +0100 Subject: RE: Re[3]: bhp Could someone please sort this out? > ---------- > From: mailuser@xxx.nz] > Sent: 12 June 1997 08:46 > To: diy_efi@xxx.edu > Subject: Re: Re[3]: bhp > > Automated reply from Massey University Electronic Mail System > --------- ----- ---- ------ ---------- ---------- ---- ------ > > The message you have sent to > > diy_efi@xxx.edu > > has been delivered. > > Please note: > This person is currently not an active EMail user and is therefore > unlikely > to read their mail. All unread mail is deleted after approximately > 2 months > ------------------------------ From: barrettn@xxx.net (Barrett Nicholas) Date: Fri, 13 Jun 1997 14:21:48 GMT Subject: plugs & hp increases Jeffrey: Another explaination for the HP increases you saw by changing plugs (and I've heard this attributed to Bosch Platinum plugs in '92 and later 3 series BMWs) is that with that plug you're getting some detonation and the knock sensor is dialing back the spark advance. I've used Bosch Platinum plugs in my VW Jetta, it really liked them, but it sounds like some cars don't like them for whatever reasons. ------------------------------ From: "Corey L. Cole" Date: Fri, 13 Jun 1997 08:01:01 -0700 Subject: Re: bhp > > Sometimes something a lot less awesome than a Merlin. Several > > thousand miles ago I changed from Bosch Platinum plugs to Motorcraft. > > > > My 2.3l Turbo Coupe motor LOVED 'em! I must have picked up 25 hp. > > My guess is that the Bosch plugs were misfiring enough to screw up my > > a/f ratios but not enough to detect in the seat-o-pants dyno. > > I don't think this is too far beyond belief. I think the current recommendation for spark plugs in turbo Buicks is the AC-Delcos that they came with (plus or minus a few heat ranges). Those motors don't "like" the platinum plugs. Anybody out there have any suggestions as to why some turbo motors don't like platinum plugs? - -- ============================================================================== Corey L. Cole | Overheard at a party... M/S 19-HH | Peter Grant: Hello, Mr. Dylan, I'm Peter E-mail: corey.l.cole@xxx. Phone: 206-662-3596 | Bob Dylan: Hey, I don't come to you with | my problems. ============================================================================== Disclaimer: If I'm not speaking FORTRAN, I'm not speaking for Boeing. ------------------------------ From: "George M. Dailey" Date: Fri, 13 Jun 1997 11:35:38 -0500 (CDT) Subject: Bosh platinums track record What about the GM L98 Tuned port engines, do they like Bosh platinums? I've got some in my engine now that came with it when it was purchased. And of course, it always seems there should be just a little more power. I've wrote it off to my 2.73:1 gear ratio and 27-1/8" diameter P255 60-15's. Does anyone have the gear ratios for the 700R4 tranny? It seems like my gas milage in the city has dropped from 13 -14 to 12-13. Dope! GMD At 08:01 AM 6/13/97 -0700, you wrote: >I don't think this is too far beyond belief. I think the current >recommendation for spark plugs in turbo Buicks is the AC-Delcos that they >came with (plus or minus a few heat ranges). Those motors don't "like" the >platinum plugs. > >Anybody out there have any suggestions as to why some turbo motors don't like >platinum plugs? >Corey L. Cole George M. Dailey gmd@xxx.com ------------------------------ From: "Harper, Kevin" Date: Fri, 13 Jun 1997 10:52:32 -0700 Subject: RE: plugs & hp increases >---------- >From: barrettn@xxx.net] >Sent: Friday, June 13, 1997 7:21 AM >To: jengel@xxx.edu >Subject: plugs & hp increases Unsubscribe delete from list >Jeffrey: Another explaination for the HP increases you saw by changing >plugs (and I've heard this attributed to Bosch Platinum plugs in '92 >and later 3 series BMWs) is that with that plug you're getting some >detonation and the knock sensor is dialing back the spark advance. >I've used Bosch Platinum plugs in my VW Jetta, it really liked them, >but it sounds like some cars don't like them for whatever reasons. > ------------------------------ From: "Harper, Kevin" Date: Fri, 13 Jun 1997 10:51:25 -0700 Subject: RE: bhp >---------- >From: Corey L. Cole[SMTP:corey.l.cole@xxx.com] >Sent: Friday, June 13, 1997 8:01 AM >To: diy_efi@xxx.edu >Subject: Re: bhp Unsubscribe delete from list > >> > Sometimes something a lot less awesome than a Merlin. Several >> > thousand miles ago I changed from Bosch Platinum plugs to Motorcraft. >> > >> > My 2.3l Turbo Coupe motor LOVED 'em! I must have picked up 25 hp. >> > My guess is that the Bosch plugs were misfiring enough to screw up my >> > a/f ratios but not enough to detect in the seat-o-pants dyno. >> > >I don't think this is too far beyond belief. I think the current >recommendation for spark plugs in turbo Buicks is the AC-Delcos that they >came with (plus or minus a few heat ranges). Those motors don't "like" the >platinum plugs. > >Anybody out there have any suggestions as to why some turbo motors don't like >platinum plugs? > >-- >============================================================================= >= >Corey L. Cole | Overheard at a party... > M/S 19-HH | Peter Grant: Hello, Mr. Dylan, I'm Peter > E-mail: corey.l.cole@xxx. > Phone: 206-662-3596 | Bob Dylan: Hey, I don't come to you with > | my problems. >============================================================================= >= >Disclaimer: If I'm not speaking FORTRAN, I'm not speaking for Boeing. > ------------------------------ From: Chief Date: Fri, 13 Jun 1997 14:59:53 -0400 Subject: 700R4 ratios At 11:35 AM 6/13/97 -0500, you wrote: >What about the GM L98 Tuned port engines, do they like Bosh platinums? I've >got some in my engine now that came with it when it was purchased. And of >course, it always seems there should be just a little more power. I've wrote >it off to my 2.73:1 gear ratio and 27-1/8" diameter P255 60-15's. Does >anyone have the gear ratios for the 700R4 tranny? It seems like my gas >milage in the city has dropped from 13 -14 to 12-13. Dope! > >GMD Ratios are 3.06, 1.62, 1.00, 0.70. Ed Hilker aka "Chief" 84'SS - 700R4 ------------------------------ From: "Jeffrey Engel" Date: Fri, 13 Jun 1997 18:02:20 +600 Subject: RE: bhp > From: Andrew Rabbitt > To: "'diy_efi@xxx.edu'" > > Subject: RE: bhp > Date: Fri, 13 Jun 1997 09:50:45 +0100 > Reply-to: diy_efi@xxx.edu > > > Sometimes something a lot less awesome than a Merlin. Several > > thousand miles ago I changed from Bosch Platinum plugs to Motorcraft. > > > > My 2.3l Turbo Coupe motor LOVED 'em! I must have picked up 25 hp. > > My guess is that the Bosch plugs were misfiring enough to screw up my > > a/f ratios but not enough to detect in the seat-o-pants dyno. > > > I'm afraid that if you can't detect a misfire with your > seat-of-the-pants dyno, I fail to believe you can measure 25hp with the > same device! Good point! However, I've read that humans can't generally detect less than 7% misfire. I suspect that with a couple percent misfire would add a bunch of HC to the exhaust and confuse the heck out of the EEC-IV. Barrett Nicholas mentioned knock. That is also possible. My understanding is that platinum plugs run quite a bit hotter to keep the deposits burned off. 25hp? You'd have to feel the difference. It's quite noticeable. je jengel@xxx.net "I can resist anything but temptation" Mark Twain ------------------------------ From: sdelanty@xxx.net Date: Fri, 13 Jun 1997 18:46:17 -0700 Subject: RE: Hydrualic pressure to HP formula >> therefore Power = Volume Flow * Pressure (drop) >Wrong. You must also consider the density of the liquid, and the head >loss. Head loss is not pressure drop. Well, yeah, technically it's wrong, but by how much? Head loss is inconsequential on closed hydraulic systems. The fluid is returned to the tank at roughly the same height as the inlet. Any difference between these points is worth less than 0.44psi per foot with water. Hyd oils usually have a S.G. between 0.6- 0.8 , so a -100- foot head causes a loss of 35 psi or less. A 3 foot head is about the most You will ever see in closed hyd systems. _Maybe_ a 1 psi loss out of 2000 or so.... Unless You need to know power requirements down to 0.1percent, power= volume of flow x pressure. I didn't check the gentlemans metric formula, but in my world of U.S. measurements and fixin lotsa hyd stuff for a living: HP = GPM X PSI / 1714 This is the formula I use for sizing hyd equipment and it appears in most books on hydraulics. I've never seen corrections for "head" pressure or S.G. in hyd formulas. The only other correction factor is for pump or motor efficiency but fluid motors are quite good, usually 95 percent or better.... >> Note that this is a derivative of the Work=Force*Distance => >> Power=Force*Vel. >Your derivation is wrong. Yeah, but by an inconsequential amount. Happy motoring, Steve Delanty (sdelanty@xxx.net) 1971 F100, FE390, T-18 4-speed shortbox. ------------------------------ From: sdelanty@xxx.net Date: Fri, 13 Jun 1997 18:46:13 -0700 Subject: RE: Hydrualic pressure to HP formula >What's formula for converting hydraulic pressure into horspower? For >instance, at 24 Gallons/Min @ 2300 PSI, what's the equivalent >horsepower? 32.205 HP HP = PSI X GPM / 1714 Err, whatcha makin? Happy motoring, Steve Delanty (sdelanty@xxx.net) 1971 F100, FE390, T-18 4-speed shortbox. ------------------------------ From: Frank Swygert Date: Fri, 13 Jun 1997 23:31:06 -0400 Subject: Re: Diy_Efi for '49-53 Ford Flathead Bob, I'm considering somrthing similar with my 63 Rambler six. Only I will be going to the bigger 258 (4.2L) as found in Jeeps. They make TBI kits for these, but I'd really like to "roll my own". That is unless I find a good 4.0L Jeep engine (88-97... of course I want an older one!) to drop in. Robert G. Stewart wrote: > > Hello Fellow Gearheads!! > > I'm thinking of starting a project in the future (only limited by time & > $$$$ - the usual stuff!). I plan on using a Ford Flathead of the '49-53 > vintage for a nostalgia type street rod type vehicle. Too stick with the > 50's look I plan on using dial throttle body injections pods on a intake > manafold designed for 2 2 brl carbs. I am familiar with the GM cross fire > injection system of the early eighties - and plan on using this set-up and > compter as a start, only I plan to use the injection pods from two 1.8 L > Pontiac Sunbirds instead of the throttle bodies off of the cross fire > injection as it was intended for a 5.0L V-8, and my displacement is approx > 3.9L. I would use all other sensors and the dist. in this tranfer. I also > have access to an OCD scan tool. What do you guys think of the > feasibility???? Please email me back, and/or add me to your list of > subscribers. I have a degree in electronics, work as a mechanical designer, > and grew up around my dad's auto repair shop - so I can talk your language > as well as handle the tools. > > Thanks > > Bob Stewart > rstewart@xxx.com ------------------------------ From: Stefano Date: Sat, 14 Jun 1997 09:08:18 +0200 Subject: O2 sensor meter I have made the EGO sensor meter for my car, but I have found that the voltage across LAMBDA sensor is not stable. I mean, when the engine is running at its minimum (about 800 RPM), the voltage go up and down around 0.5 V with a frequency about 3-5 Hz. Why? How can I connect your EGO sensor meter in order to have a stable value? Best regards Stefano Romani ------------------------------ End of DIY_EFI Digest V2 #201 ***************************** To subscribe to DIY_EFI-Digest, send the command: subscribe diy_efi-digest in the body of a message to "Majordomo@xxx. 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