DIY_EFI Digest Friday, 25 July 1997 Volume 02 : Number 249 In this issue: list? Re: list? Ignition Controllers intel's D8763-1 EPROM Re: Ignition Controllers Re: Ignition Controllers Re: Ignition Controllers Re: Ignition Controllers See the end of the digest for information on subscribing to the DIY_EFI or DIY_EFI-Digest mailing lists. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: James Weiler Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 16:46:11 -0700 (PDT) Subject: list? Is the list dead or have I been bumped off? jw ------------------------------ From: Michael McBroom Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 18:18:43 -0700 Subject: Re: list? James Weiler wrote: > > Is the list dead or have I been bumped off? Shhhh! You might wake 'em up :) - -- Best, Michael McBroom '87 745T 123k w/APC (batoutahell!) '88 765T 154k _________________________________________________________________________ Graduate Student, Linguistics Author of Research Interest: Biological Origins =McBroom's Camera Bluebook= of Language http://mcbrooms.com California State University, Fullerton _________________________________________________________________________ ------------------------------ From: Rob Skala Date: Fri, 25 Jul 1997 09:27:48 +0800 Subject: Ignition Controllers Hi All, I am contemplating constructing a digital igniton system (similar to the one designed by Tim Drury). based on a Hc11 microcontroller. I want to incorporate a few additional features one of which in knock control. Does anyone out there have any advice as to the best method to implement this ? Ideally what I would like to do is advance the timing to the onset of knock and then retard it slightly back into the safe zone. The controller will be used on a fuel injected 12A turbo rotary engine. I welcome all ideas and comments about this. Thanks to all in advance for your help Regards, Rob Robert D Skala Research Associate Special Research Centre for Advanced Mineral and Materials Processing University of Western Australia Nedlands Western Australia 6907 Tel: (618) 9380 1581 Fax: (618) 9380 1116 email: robskala@xxx.au ------------------------------ From: "barry coleman" Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 18:24:35 PDT Subject: intel's D8763-1 EPROM DIY_EFI list, This is my first post to this fascinating list and I have kept silent until now because I wanted to ask a question that wasn't in the archives already, so here is is: Does anybody on the list know the pinout/specs for this EPROM? It is from my EEC-IV ("DC" calibration code, aka '88 SD SEFI 5.0HO). This EPROM is in a weird 24 pin DIP package and it officially doesn't exist. Thanks in advance. Barry Coleman a 351C w/SEFI...why didn't Ford think of that? fvoho@xxx.com ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ From: Bruno! Date: Fri, 25 Jul 1997 12:23:48 +1000 (EST) Subject: Re: Ignition Controllers On Fri, 25 Jul 1997, Rob Skala wrote: [snippity-snip] > incorporate a few additional features one of which in knock control. > > Does anyone out there have any advice as to the best method to implement > this ? Ideally what I would like to do is advance the timing to the onset > of knock and then retard it slightly back into the safe zone. The > controller will be used on a fuel injected 12A turbo rotary engine. If your engine needs to be run with the ddis before you implement knock, you could have the controller emulate a distributor initially, and (dons the asbestos underwear) gradually tweak the timing so that you might be able to get the engine to ping. If not, you may be able to set the dizzy to do so. You could record the engine sounds by bolting a microphone to the engine somewhere (or maybe even 3 or 4, near the valves :)) to find the best point where to "listen" for this condition. I've read that this should not continue for very long, if you want the engine to survive. The signal could then be filtered out and cleaned up to give a knock sensor "switch". Make sure that other egine noises do not make the sensor think it's knocking when it isn't. I'll be undergoing a similar development with my car soon, and i'll be posting results as they come to hand. Good luck, Bruno. (b.marzano@xxx.au) On the internet, no-one can hear you scream. ------------------------------ From: Jeremy Fleming Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 22:22:41 -0600 Subject: Re: Ignition Controllers On 24-Jul-97, Rob Skala wrote: >Ideally what I would like to do is advance the timing to the onset >of knock and then retard it slightly back into the safe zone. The >controller will be used on a fuel injected 12A turbo rotary engine. >I welcome all ideas and comments about this. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'm interested as well. I have a stock 13B 6p, and I would like to improve the power output. Unfortunately, I don't have a clue what ECU Mazda used on the '86 GXL for spark control. Seeing as how detonation tends to break apex seals right and left, I would need some form of knock sensing ignition if any forced induction is to be added. I'm all ears if anyone has any experience in this area. Jeremy Fleming jeremy@xxx.net jeremy@xxx.com ------------------------------ From: Sandy Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 20:49:58 -0700 Subject: Re: Ignition Controllers At 09:27 AM 7/25/97 +0800, you wrote: > >Hi All, > >I am contemplating constructing a digital igniton system (similar to the >one designed by Tim Drury). based on a Hc11 microcontroller. I want to >incorporate a few additional features one of which in knock control. > >Does anyone out there have any advice as to the best method to implement >this ? Ideally what I would like to do is advance the timing to the onset >of knock and then retard it slightly back into the safe zone. The >controller will be used on a fuel injected 12A turbo rotary engine. > >I welcome all ideas and comments about this. > Harris makes a part that is for Knock Control, check the Web site for the part number. Also TI has a application for one of their low end DSP chips that lets you do it a bit more elegantly. The Harris part uses moto's SPI buss so if the varient of processor you choose has it, it will be an easy interface. I'm not sure how hard it is to get the part, but it is a start. Sandy ------------------------------ From: Seth Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 23:03:13 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: Ignition Controllers On Fri, 25 Jul 1997, Rob Skala wrote: > > Hi All, > > I am contemplating constructing a digital igniton system (similar to the > one designed by Tim Drury). based on a Hc11 microcontroller. I want to > incorporate a few additional features one of which in knock control. > > Does anyone out there have any advice as to the best method to implement > this ? Ideally what I would like to do is advance the timing to the onset > of knock and then retard it slightly back into the safe zone. The > controller will be used on a fuel injected 12A turbo rotary engine. > > I welcome all ideas and comments about this. > > Thanks to all in advance for your help > > Regards, > > Rob > > > > Robert D Skala Robert- somewhere I have either an SAE paper on VW's knock sensor ignition, or a book with it in it. From what I remember, the knocking rings the belock like a bell and the knock sensor is placed at a node of great intensity. The piezo electric microphone output is filtered with a high and lo pass filter to diminish all input other than the knocking frequency. Then the computer (which also has a manifold absolute pressure sender) determines the map and listens for knock. If it hears it , then it iterates through advance and retard cycles. The 1985 VW system wasn't adaptive, and is often accused of being too sensitive. If I can find technical documentation, I will post it. I used to have 3d plots of ignition maps, and some sort of photographic technique that showed the ringing of the block. Seth Allen PS this topic wwas discussed a while back, at least as far as knock sensor placement, with suggestions like bolting the sensor the edge of the block near the oil pan, if I remember correctly. ------------------------------ End of DIY_EFI Digest V2 #249 ***************************** To subscribe to DIY_EFI-Digest, send the command: subscribe diy_efi-digest in the body of a message to "Majordomo@xxx. A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to subscribe to that instead, replace "diy_efi-digest" in the command above with "diy_efi".