DIY_EFI Digest Wednesday, 20 August 1997 Volume 02 : Number 281 In this issue: Clicking in 89 Mazda 323... For REALLY good mileage check this out TEC-II - serial protocol Re: For REALLY good mileage check this out Re: For REALLY good mileage check this out Re: For REALLY good mileage check this out; what a waste of bandwidth See the end of the digest for information on subscribing to the DIY_EFI or DIY_EFI-Digest mailing lists. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Thor Johnson Date: Tue, 19 Aug 1997 08:38:35 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Clicking in 89 Mazda 323... Hmm. this might not be the right place for it, so respond privately if you think it is more appropriate. I just got a Mazda 323 (1.6l port FI), and it clicks.... I am thinking that it is a distorted ping/knock cuz it doesn't do it if I use "el supre" gas (93+oct boost), but will do it loaded uphill, AC and low test gas. Does the Mazda EFI control timing, or can I adjust it (grr. A/C unit is mounted infront of the marks) without any problems? Whattype EFI is on this car and waht does it control (thinking about rolling another 68hc11 EFI unit and putting it in... but need to know that functionality I am replacing first). Thor Johnson johnsont@xxx.edu http://falcon.cs.mercer.edu/~johnsont Have you seen the WarpMap lately? http://falcon.cs.mercer.edu/~johnsont/warpmap ------------------------------ From: Terry Martin Date: Tue, 19 Aug 1997 18:00:32 -0700 Subject: For REALLY good mileage check this out http://home.earthlink.net/~josephnewman/ I dunno, but I suspects that this URL should read http://home.The Planet.ZORGON ------------------------------ From: "Zublin, Bryan (SD-MS)" Date: Tue, 19 Aug 1997 19:08:00 -0700 (PDT) Subject: TEC-II - serial protocol This email was posted to the Toyota-mods list and I received permission from the author to post it to the DIY_EFI list as it is relevant. Bryan Zublin bzublin@xxx.com ---------- From: GSMnow@xxx.com To: fjo@xxx.com Subject: Re: TEC-II - serial protocol??? Date: Saturday, August 02, 1997 8:52AM For the programs that I have written to interogeat my TEC, this is what is in my notes. Wow, it has been a while since I messed with this stuff. A little dissclaimer here, this info was arrived at by experimenting with a prom version 33 TEC !! unit, there is no gurantee that it will work on any other version. open the serial port for no handshaking no parity at 2400 bps 8 bit Send the string T8 yes just a capital T and an 8 no return or anything else, and there must be a short amount of time between them, fast computers sometimes crash the link without a delay. The TEC will respond by sending back 17 bytes of data. The first 2 bytes are the rpm sent as a 16 bit number, first byte is the high 8 bits. But it is not the exact rpm, I have to multiply the 16 bit number by 1.4652, 1.5 is close enough manifold pressure is the fourth byte with 0 to 255 representing the 0 to 5 volts from the MAP sensor, mine has a little offset and tops out at 208 kpa or about 15.5 psi of boost. I use the calculation raw MAP val * .7378 + 20.6692 to get kpa from the 0 to 255 value ignition advance is byte 3. 0 is zero advance and each count is 1/4 degree to 60 degrees at 240 coolant temp is the 5th byte air temp is the 9th byte I have not got the scaling for these yet. tps sensor is byte 10 0 - 255 is 0 to 5 volts O2 sensor is on byte 16 with 0 to 255 equal to 0 to 1 volt battery volts is on byte 11 forgot the scale Knock sensor is byte 8 big number is knocking Accelerator pump appears to be on byte 7 The current gama value being used by the injection appears to be byte 6 I also remember finding bits that change when it is rich or lean and trying to correct, and when the injectors would go into coast down cut out, but I can't find thi sinfo now I hope this helps someone. I have several data logging and tuning aids I have written, but they are giving me trouble trying to get them working on my HP200 palmtop. I will be using the huge 1989 386sx laptop I wrote them on today. Gary M. ------------------------------ From: pantera@xxx.com (David Doddek) Date: Tue, 19 Aug 1997 23:07:59 -0500 (CDT) Subject: Re: For REALLY good mileage check this out >http://home.earthlink.net/~josephnewman/ > >I dunno, but I suspects that this URL should read http://home.The >Planet.ZORGON > > > If the guy was not trying to be so much of a salesman, the theory is actually quite interesting. And really he is not getting something for nothing. What he has actually invented is an extreemely save nuclear reactor because what is actually happening is the copper atom is providing the power as it is being destroyed. Any other Engineers or Scientists care to comment. David Doddek pantera@xxx.com/~pantera 217-422-3722 69 EFI Fairlane, 89 T-bird SC, 74 Twin turbo NOS EFI Pantera #6825 If you are going to go fast, go real fast. ------------------------------ From: "Michael D. Porter" Date: Wed, 20 Aug 1997 00:11:31 -0700 Subject: Re: For REALLY good mileage check this out David Doddek wrote: > > If the guy was not trying to be so much of a salesman, the theory is > actually quite interesting. And really he is not getting something for > nothing. What he has actually invented is an extreemely save nuclear > reactor because what is actually happening is the copper atom is providing > the power as it is being destroyed. Any other Engineers or Scientists care > to comment. He is a salesman, and of snake oil to boot. The US Patent Office is very clear on the subject of such machines. If they are claimed to produce work without energy input, they are perpetual motion machines, which are not patentable. In both his description of book and process, and in his "special report," virtually all is testimonial. The test he described, using line voltage from the power company was, I believe, later debunked. The device was equipped with a hidden current source. Several times, he uses the analogy of hydraulics to describe the effects of high voltage in his device. Any idiot knows that something has to produce the hydraulic pressure, and that something is work, whether it's a motor turning a hydraulic pump, or one's foot pushing on a brake pedal. Next, he makes only vague allusions to the power from the device as coming from the destruction of copper atoms in the device coil. That destruction, or conversion can only occur by two means--fission, or fusion--and in both cases, radiation is emitted. Period. Newman makes no such claim. Further, Newman describes his device as working to "excite" the copper atoms. Electronic shell theory observes the Laws of Conservation. Energy input into an atom of just about anything excites the electrons. But not to move at the speed of light, as he describes. They are already moving at the speed of light. His "gyroscopic movement" of the electrons is, in actuality, inferred from the physical data, and is not literal. Put energy into an atom, and its outermost electrons go to higher electron shells. The law of conservation regarding entropy says that everything relaxes to its lowest energy level, and the electron is no exception, releasing energy in quanta to return to its original level. That quanta can be of all sorts of electromagnetic energy and light, but never more than the original input. Now to the inference that the device derives its high output from fission or fusion. Fission, in the context of this device, can only occur with unstable elements in the presence of an excess of neutrons. This condition cannot exist in a coil of copper. As to fusion, this occurs principally among atoms of light elements which, by virtue of tremendous energy input, overcome the atomic force which keeps atoms apart from each other, thus making a new atom of another, heavier element. According to the curve of binding energy, energy is released (this is true, up to iron). Again, unstable elements are necessary, or are at least more efficient at fusion--isotopes with additional neutrons. Again, this is not possible in an ordinary coil of copper. Last, Maxwell proved, rather simply and elegantly, that water and electricity obey much the same laws. Water pressure is analogous to emf (voltage), and yet, with the tap off, or the stream blocked, no water is available to do work. The water itself is analogous to current. Water moves, work is done. This fellow is saying that work is done virtually without current, and that the heat normally produced by current flow generated by back emf is captured and recycled without being dissipated as heat. No explanation for the phenomenon is given. Current flow, not voltage potential, produces electromagnetic effects, and current flow produces heat, because of the resistance of wire (this, of course, is the reason for current interest in superconductors). No formula anywhere for this is presented except Einstein's matter-energy conversion formula, E=mc_2. For Einstein's formula to apply in any meaningful way, fission or fusion must occur. And Einstein's formula, as has been proven frequently, still obeys the laws of conservation. Newman promotes without providing any scientific evidence, and for that reason alone, there are lingering doubts. The articles in the web site say that the device has been patented in other countries. Those countries are not cited. If any one of them has reciprocal patent protection laws with the US, there is no reason whatsoever that the device would not have been snapped up by a manufacturer in a foreign country and would currently be in production. If it actually worked. My general feeling is that this is one of the longest-running scientific hoaxes to be perpetrated on the public, and continues because of the relative lack of scientific education of the lay public. If this fellow were a true scientist and has found fundamental new laws, he would not hesitate to submit them for peer review, publication and testing for replication of results. Had he done that, instead of rail at the US Patent Office for their shortsightedness, he might have some credibility. Under the circumstances as described, he would have no problem defending earlier patent applications, were the system to work. This is the National Enquirer version of the cold fusion debacle. Cheers. - -- My other Triumph runs, but.... ------------------------------ From: Terry Martin Date: Tue, 19 Aug 1997 23:54:36 -0700 Subject: Re: For REALLY good mileage check this out; what a waste of bandwidth David Doddek wrote: > > >http://home.earthlink.net/~josephnewman/ > > > >I dunno, but I suspects that this URL should read http://home.The > >Planet.ZORGON > If the guy was not trying to be so much of a salesman, the theory is > actually quite interesting. And really he is not getting something for > nothing. What he has actually invented is an extreemely save nuclear > reactor because what is actually happening is the copper atom is providing > the power as it is being destroyed. Any other Engineers or Scientists care > to comment. > > David Doddek pantera@xxx.com/~pantera 217-422-3722 > 69 EFI Fairlane, 89 T-bird SC, 74 Twin turbo NOS EFI Pantera #6825 > If you are going to go fast, go real fast. INSERT HERE THIS IS JUST SLICK SPAM Any OTHER engineers? That's scary. Ahhh, but this is scientific debate. Off the subject, I like the NOS part in your sig. MMM, MMM, smells great. No.., not actually? Actually, I'm not an Engineer (big E on purpose), and I do dare, or was that care, to comment. I want to know what this guys' personal hydro bill was for the last two years. (Power paid for at residence for personal consumption). The theory is not only not interesting, it's a copy off Tesla's concepts and doesn't work. Disclaimer: While this is off the stated topic of this group. I think it's important that anyone interested in dyi-efi understand what bullshit is, no matter how it's perfumed. This has nothing to do with cold or hot fusion or fission. It has to do with some shmuck dedicating his life, and lots of other people's money and time to a pack of crap that does not even pass the first priciples of thermo-dynamics. But they're wrong don't you see, a quantum of electro-magnetic energy is mis-represented. The (apparent) argument is that E don't equal mc2, statement to the contrary notwithstanding, and that in the absence of a super conducting coil, a gyroscopic shift in the coil position equals a quantum energy packet being released for work. It's crap. It's as simple as this; energy in = less energy out, or in the quantum world of fissionable material, (which copper is not, or it would be something else), E=mc2. Somehow the guy has missed the fact that even in fission, you have something left behind. If he wants proof, I can arrange for him to sit on fusionable material, (less energetic and way dirtier), and he will experience first hand how to get "blowed up good" without any inconsistency in E=mc2. Gimee an air-bag. The two things the guy would not let the "testers" from the patent office do is destroy it in the process of testing, a reasonable precautionary request, given the "fissionable or fusionable" testing protocol, and to "ground" the device. The restrictions on testing protocol interest me. "The destruction of the device" one could assume as just a knee-jerk reaction to having one's life work go up in smoke. So, notwithstanding the inability of repetitive testing, which by the way, to the enquirer is the foundation of science, what's up with the ground problem. OH, to dump excess energy, I see. That's something every power source should do to keep from what? getting blowed up good? I would suggest a big capacitor, or how about a phase converting voltage and current regulating power dump, like a battery. No? Why not? Maybe THE CHINA SYNDROME will happen. OOOH NOOOO. I will admit to knowing nothing more than I have posted here. If you are doing efi work, keep it up. If you are doing perpetual moron machines which defy thermo-dynamics, keep it up, it'll keep you away from real science. You arrived on this planet as a result of thermo-dynamics, and have what intelligence you have as a result of evolution working as bio-dynamics within the constraints of thermo-dynamics. It is a fundamental principle of evolution; that the stupider you are, the less likely you are to reproduce, within current technology. You could be right, and all the left over's after the brains get themselves blowed up good, will be your worshipers. My, what a thought. To be proven a genuine prophet, as opposed to a lucky,(for you), guess. I'll wish I was you. Otherwise, I'll teach my kids, the more outlandish the claim, the stricter the proof as to its veracity. Blow it, and go, Terry ------------------------------ End of DIY_EFI Digest V2 #281 ***************************** To subscribe to DIY_EFI-Digest, send the command: subscribe diy_efi-digest in the body of a message to "Majordomo@xxx. 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