DIY_EFI Digest Thursday, 12 November 1998 Volume 03 : Number 536 In this issue: Homemade A/F Meter Re: Help needed reading Prom. Re: hello Re: BOUNCE diy_efi: Admin request (fwd) Re: TRACTION CONTROL Re: setting ignition curves without dyno Re: GM 4 Cylinder Engines Re: TRACTION CONTROL Re: EFI Please???? Re: TRACTION CONTROL Re: BOUNCE diy_efi: Admin request (fwd) RE: ? on Mr Hall Effect RE: ? on Mr Hall Effect See the end of the digest for information on subscribing to the DIY_EFI or DIY_EFI-Digest mailing lists. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Khoo Teck-Khoon" Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 18:51:18 PST Subject: Homemade A/F Meter Help! I have found diagrams for a A/F Meter using a O2 sensor. However, my car does not come with a O2 sensor. Therefore, I have to source from other places. Anyway, I have found a 2 wire O2 sensor which I have tested to be 1 wire for the voltage signal and the other seems to be for the heater element. Is there a 2 wire heated O2 sensor? Because there only seems to be signal when I connect 1 wire to the multitester and the other connected to the neck of the O2 sensor, no signal if I connect to the other wire. Anyway, the problem is with the signal...very low voltage i.e. about 0.05 to 0.075 volts. The voltage seems to change whenever I lean/richen the mixture. But the voltage should not be this low, right? I have placed the O2 sensor about 2 feet away from the collector pipe but it seems to be sitting quite high...maybe the O2 sensor is not getting enough of the exhaust gas? Somebody please help me with this problem soon because I intend to get the LM3914 to built a better monitor. Regards, tkkhoo@xxx.com ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ From: "David A. Cooley" Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 21:59:09 -0500 Subject: Re: Help needed reading Prom. At 05:03 PM 11/11/98 -0800, you wrote: >> Hi to you all, >> I have come across a 28 pin prom that I just cant get a stable checksum >> on. When I read it as a 27C128 I get FF in the bottom half of memory and >> what looks like data in the top half. With the prom in its own circuit >> pin 28 (VCC) is joined to pin 26 (A13) which would explain that they are >> only looking for data in the top section of the prom and why the bottom >> section is all FF. >> The prom data lines "D0" to "D7" going to the MC68hc11 are all >> reversed, "D0 goes to "D7", D1" goes to "D6" etc. This of course will >> give the incorrect hex readings when the prom is read but what is >> causing the checksum to be different on every read attempt? >> I have made sure all the pins are very clean as I know from experience >> this can cause different checksums. >> Any help would be gladly welcome. Richard, This sounds like the newer chips the GM cars were using... Should still be a 27128 or 27256, but they scramble the address and data lines to make the code basically unreadable if you read it like a "normal" prom. If you make an adapter to cross the leads like they are in the PCM, you can read the code properly. As to the Checksum changing, compare the BIN between 2 reads and see what changes. I had a similar problem with an MCT eprom burner... The replacement Jameco sent me was the same... It conflicts with the PC's RAM. Bought a Needhams PB10 for the same price and no more problems. Later, DAve =========================================================== David Cooley N5XMT Internet: N5XMT@xxx.net Packet: N5XMT@xxx. Member #7068 I am Pentium of Borg...division is futile...you will be approximated. =========================================================== ------------------------------ From: EFISYSTEMS@xxx.com Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 21:59:14 EST Subject: Re: hello In a message dated 11/4/98 9:18:57 PM Pacific Standard Time, terryk@xxx.net writes: << Hi Carl, Do you happen to have the 91 V6 TBI truck code? My bother-in-law has one and I wanted to do some tweaking. Regards Terry Kelley >> Hi Terry, Are you looking for a bin file or the entire code dump?????The code is the same as the v-8, the lookup tables distinguish the engine...let me know,,,,sorry for the delay haven't checked the mail in a while.... - -Carl Summers ------------------------------ From: thergen@xxx.net Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 19:06:26 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: BOUNCE diy_efi: Admin request (fwd) I suppose it could be a page addressed eprom like an intel 27513. Pins 11 and 12 double as bank select lines using pin 27 as we~ and pin 1 is rst~. I'm assuming the eprom is not in _any_ type of carrier. There should be some info in the archives on read protect schemes when some type of carrier is used. It looks like the mail may have bounced to admin because the machine name doesn't match the ip address: kojab.ar.com.au (dialup173.ar.com.au [203.18.148.173]) On Wed, 11 Nov 1998, Orin Eman wrote: > > >From diy_efi-owner@xxx.edu Wed Nov 11 16:18:26 1998 > > Received: from ar.ar.com.au (root@xxx.1]) > > by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA21764 > > for ; Wed, 11 Nov 1998 16:18:23 -0500 > > Received: from kojab.ar.com.au (dialup173.ar.com.au [203.18.148.173]) > > by ar.ar.com.au (8.9.1/8.9.1/AR-1.1) with SMTP id IAA20963 > > for ; Thu, 12 Nov 1998 08:20:10 +1100 > > Message-ID: <3649FD73.4ED7@xxx.au> > > Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1998 08:11:15 +1100 > > From: Richard Wakeling > > X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I) > > MIME-Version: 1.0 > > To: diy_efi@xxx.edu > > Subject: Help needed reading Prom. > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > > Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > > > Hi to you all, > > I have come across a 28 pin prom that I just cant get a stable checksum > > on. When I read it as a 27C128 I get FF in the bottom half of memory and > > what looks like data in the top half. With the prom in its own circuit > > pin 28 (VCC) is joined to pin 26 (A13) which would explain that they are > > only looking for data in the top section of the prom and why the bottom > > section is all FF. > > The prom data lines "D0" to "D7" going to the MC68hc11 are all > > reversed, "D0 goes to "D7", D1" goes to "D6" etc. This of course will > > give the incorrect hex readings when the prom is read but what is > > causing the checksum to be different on every read attempt? > > I have made sure all the pins are very clean as I know from experience > > this can cause different checksums. > > Any help would be gladly welcome. > > > Thanks in advance > > Cheers Richard. > ------------------------------ From: "Bruce Plecan" Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 22:14:39 -0500 Subject: Re: TRACTION CONTROL - -----Original Message----- From: soren To: diy_efi@xxx.edu> Date: Wednesday, November 11, 1998 9:39 PM Subject: Re: TRACTION CONTROL >>I am wanting to do a DIY traction control. >>Does anyone know if OEM systems use ABS/apply brakes or >>retard timing in the event of lost traction.. > There are examples of systems that use both techniques. Some >supercharged GM vehicles open up the boost control solenoid to >decrease power in the event of traction loss. However, I see no >reason why you would want to encumber your car with either ABS >or traction control; a knowledgeable driver with decent reflexes can >usually outperform either system. >Soren Key word here usually. I gots a car that is very hard to modulate the throttle to keep the hides hooked (actually just the first two gears). Besides, the inner glow of powering thru some water, and having it work perfect is a neat feeling, As for the comment about the cat converter, for that retard+fuel control sounds better than my stutter. The drop every 7th pulse was not as rough as a miss with a dead cylinder. When it hit the rvry 5th shot ya that was quite noticeable. But, I had to run some Big steps in retard to hold it back, think was 4-6-9, and it would hit the 19 total. Please excuse the none EFI but the ABS can really be used well in scca parking lot events, watch some good vette drivers. Bruce > ------------------------------ From: Tom Sharpe Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 21:13:55 -0600 Subject: Re: setting ignition curves without dyno Greg Hermann wrote: > >How about this idea..............actually build a dyno into your car. A > >company called Land & Sea offer a product called "DYNOmite" which > >nonintrusively measures driveshaft torque and computes a host of parameters, > >including HP. With such a product, every run on the street or track can > >be a dyno session. I've been contemplating doing this to my project for > >awhile. > > > >Land & Sea is on the Web, and they are also at 1-603-329-5645. I'd > >personally be interested in hearing from anyone who has tried this, or knows > >of anyone who has tried this. > > > >Thanks. > > > Not tried either it or the following described idea, but had been > contemplating doing as follows--mount a fore and aft oriented accelerometer > in the vehicle and include its output in a datalogging setup. A fuel used > pulse (or whatever sort of computed integration of fuel used) output from > the ecu could also be a very helpful thing to datalog in this regard. > > ---Greg You should be able to determine crankshaft acceleration from the crank sensor.... Just more clutter for the programmer..... Regards Tom ------------------------------ From: Jim Davies Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 19:29:12 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: GM 4 Cylinder Engines On Mon, 9 Nov 1998 ECMnut@xxx.com wrote: > The Turbo Sunbird was a 2.0 liter Turbo 4cyl MAP system.. > It did not have a Quad-4... It had an Austrailian produced > SOHC I think.. It was (batch) port injected. ] The ones I have seen have a Brazil built OHC engine. ------------------------------ From: Stuart Bunning Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1998 13:30:24 +1000 (EST) Subject: Re: TRACTION CONTROL I forgot to add I'm a dumb idiot with no reflexes thats why i want traction control. I'm not after personal opinions just technical FACTS... But thanks anyway for the info about supercharged GM vehicles....... >I see no reason why you would >want to encumber your car with either ABS or traction control; a >knowledgeable driver with decent reflexes can usually outperform either >system. > >Soren > > Best Regards, STUART BUNNING SALES ENGINEER KENELEC PTY LTD 23-25 REDLAND DRIVE MITCHAM VICTORIA 3132 AUSTRALIA PHONE: 61 3 9873 1022 FAX: 61 3 9873 0200 EMAIL: stuart@xxx.au WEB: http://www.kenelec.com.au/ ------------------------------ From: H Villemure Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 22:55:25 +0000 Subject: Re: EFI Please???? Jerry, I am a newcomer to diy_efi (a few weeks) and also to programming controllers. I am however an amateur mechanic and have over time become more knowledgeable of my favorite makes, mostly Asian. I have never got an answer to my very few questions, except from Danny Colionthon who happens to also be a member of Toyota-mods lists. I also have come to believe by reading the posts from diy_efi that as you say, it is only a "serious-modder" GM/Delco/Chrysler list. I am loosing interest fast and only an occasional post on Asian controllers keeps me in. Oh well. It surprises me a little of course, because the electronics of a car *govern* and *monitor* the actual processes but they don't generate them; internal combustion engines thrive on proper understanding and management of thermodynamics, and materials and design thereof. I have seen enough miserable intake and exhaust manifolds on american cars to guess that one should worry first about the more fundamental things. It is useless to try and find the perfect ignition timing for a Chrysler LeBaron GTS when you know that there is over 12% difference in flow from one intake runner to the next. Toyota engines on the other hand can take 225% of the stock power on bone stock internals, easily. I do not know many makes that can claim the same. Now, *that* is worth getting involved, in piggyback controllers or even EFI computer replacement, because it means that you can have a bolt-on turbo setup, etc., etc. Lastly, some variety always helps, as sharing "cross-platforms" can lead one to use another make's better designs for their setups. Saab, Volvo and Peugeot have a few inexpensive parts that can do better than stock, etc., etc. Hope this rambling is of any help, Jerry Wills wrote: > > of the last 237 msgs I received from DIY_EFI 58 YES "58" were about the > mechanical aspects of GM motors. I like a Big block as much as the next > guy and I love the old facts. THIS ISN'T THE PLACE, does this bother > anyone else? send msg to me jwills@xxx.edu and I'll post a single msg > with the results. > > Thanks for your attention, > > Jerry - -- Helene V. ___________________ "If it ain't broke, make it faster" Check out our mondo Toyota page at http://www.students.tut.fi/~k124476 and stay tuned for just how many miles on a 5M-GE before it dies (now 235 000) ------------------------------ From: cosmic.ray@xxx.com (Raymond C Drouillard) Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1998 00:36:01 -0500 Subject: Re: TRACTION CONTROL A friend of mine has a Camaro F-body. It has a defeatable traction control that actually uses a servo of some sort to push the accellerater up. He tells me that he can feel it kick back. He (like many owners of such cars) likes to press the "defeat" button and burn rubber. One of the German car companies (BMW, I think) uses a traction control system to help control skidding in slippery (winter, mostly) conditions. Mercedes uses a brake-actuated traction control system (part of ABS, I would assume)) to slow down a wheel that loses traction. This is for off-road use. Jeep mechanically does something similar in the transfer case and in each differential with its Quadratrack II (tm) system. Instead of stopping one of the wheels, it employs a cluch between the axles (in the axle) or between the driveshafts (in the transfer case). When a difference in speed is detected, the cluch is engaged, limiting the slip or locking the axle or transfer case. If you want to simply limit the power, you might want to consider blocking the injecter pulses rather than the ignition pulses. If you are using multipoint injection, you can selectively give any cylinder a breath of pure air rather than air-fuel mixture. Do this every seventh, fifth, or third pulse as you described, and you'll have the same effect without burdening the cat with lots of raw fuel. My Holley Pro-Jection system has a rev-limiter built in. It works by cutting the fuel when the speed gets too high (I have it set to 5300, I think). I have demonstrated it a few times. It works well. It just sort of bounces off the top of the limit and doesn't tend to smell up the place. Ray Drouillard On Wed, 11 Nov 1998 19:34:54 -0500 "Bruce Plecan" writes: > >-----Original Message----- >From: Stuart Bunning >To: diy_efi@xxx.edu > >Date: Wednesday, November 11, 1998 6:27 PM >Subject: TRACTION CONTROL > > >My "idea" was using a sudden change in VSS. Ran some 555's for generating >pulses on +and - transititions, to charge two caps. Then a voltage divide >by 10. To drop the power I did stage one at losing every 7th ignition >pulse. then very 5th, then 3rd.Problem with my design was totally >dependent >on temp to work. > Also tried using a MSD Multistep-Retard to back the timing up has three >stages, and you can add them together. > >> >>I am wanting to do a DIY traction control. >>Does anyone know if OEM systems use ABS/apply brakes or >retard timing in >the event of lost traction.. >>If it was retard timing maybe simulating a KNOCK would be a easy >way to >reduce power and get traction back. The only problem i >would see here is >how quickly doesn the ECU ( 808/165 ) give me >back full timing once a knock >has gone away. > >The decay rate is in the memcal, as well as the timing limits. > >Best idea I've seen is incorporating a front wheel speed sensor, >and comparing it to the rears, or driveshaft. >Bruce > >>Thanks in advance.... >>Best Regards, >>STUART BUNNING >>SALES ENGINEER >>KENELEC PTY LTD >>23-25 REDLAND DRIVE >>MITCHAM VICTORIA 3132 >>AUSTRALIA > stuart@xxx.au >>WEB: http://www.kenelec.com.au/ >> > > ___________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] ------------------------------ From: Orin Eman Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 22:21:50 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: BOUNCE diy_efi: Admin request (fwd) Actually, it was the word 'h_e_l_p' in the original subject. > It looks like the mail may have bounced to admin because the machine name > doesn't match the ip address: kojab.ar.com.au (dialup173.ar.com.au > [203.18.148.173]) ------------------------------ From: Carlo Putter Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1998 09:20:35 +0200 Subject: RE: ? on Mr Hall Effect - ------ =_NextPart_000_01BE0E1D.B55C0620 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Yes you are correct. The only thing that are moving in the Hall-effect sensor is the = electrons passing through it (DC-current). So is would give a constant = voltage for a constant magnetic field. (Permanent magnet). How I think = the hall-sensor is working is: In the sensing unit there is a permanent magnet, alligned with the = hall-effect sensor, pointing to the centre of the sensing wheel. When = the sensor passes one of the teeth of the sensing wheel, the magnetic = field is concentrated to the area of that tooth. This causes the = magnetic flux through the hall-effect sensor to be higher than the case = without the thoot, which would then result in a "higher" output voltage = of the sensor. Thus if the sensor is passing the teeth of the gear, the = resulting output would be a "square" wave. Remember that the hall-effect = sensor is constantly subjected to the permanent magnetic field, thus the = resulting square wave would have an ofset. (That is if no compensating = circuitry is build into the sensor). Carlo - -----Original Message----- From: Kevin Vannorsdel [SMTP:kv@xxx.com] Sent: Tuesday, November 10, 1998 6:43 PM To: diy_efi@xxx.edu Subject: Re: ? on Mr Hall Effect I have no knowledge of this particular sensor but correct me if I am = wrong.... The Hall Effect (proper) is not a transient thing right? My = recollection is that the Hall Effect occurs in the presence of a magnetic material... = not only in the "passing" of it. Time to dig out my Physics 203 book! ________________________________________________ Kevin Vannorsdel IBM Arm Electronics Development 408-256-6492 Tie 276-6492 kv@xxx.com owner-diy_efi@xxx.edu on 11/10/98 08:35:25 AM Please respond to diy_efi@xxx.edu To: diy_efi@xxx.edu cc: diy_efi@xxx.edu Subject: Re: ? on Mr Hall Effect I think the teeth improve the magnetic coupling between the powered coil and the signal coil. I would almost guess that the powered coil was powered by something other than a DC signal. Basically the power coil to the signal coil is a transformer and putting the metal near it changes how the transformer acts and that is what is detected. I do not think a DVM would be able to detect the signal good enough. There would be only one change when you moved it in closer, and that would pass by the DVM way too fast to catch. All of those devices work on transients that are probably too fast to catch with a DVM. If you have it, you may try feeding it into a sound card and see what the wave really looks like. Also if you where spinning the disk past the sensor you would be able to detect the level out the output signal (average level) changing, but would owuld not be able to detect any of the waveforms themselves. You might in the case be able to put the DVM on HZ (if yours had this) and count the number of teeth. Roger On Tue, 10 Nov 1998, Bruce Plecan wrote: > In the past, I done some trouble shooting with Hall Effect Devises. > Now, for the first time I hooked a meter to one with it sitting on the > table. The one I'm starring at is a Toyota, it has a red lead, a = white > lead, and a sheilded cable with ground. > So being the Cone Shaped Hat Wearer that I am, I did the following. = Using > a 9v battery, I grounded it to the shell of the sensor > applied + to the read lead, grounded the meter (DVM on V), > hooked the meter's lead to the white wire, and then tested it. > The test being held a gm crank disc near the tip of the toyota > sensor. The meter just flickers as I expose it to the metal?. > I thought it would open and close as the metal came close to it?, > yes/no?.. > In various gm training references they show a pattern like > > ___ ___ ___ ___ > ___I I___I I___I I___I I > > Can someone splain this to me, or refer me to an online source for > accurate info?. > Thanks > Bruce > > - ------ =_NextPart_000_01BE0E1D.B55C0620 Content-Type: application/ms-tnef Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 eJ8+IiUHAQaQCAAEAAAAAAABAAEAAQeQBgAIAAAA5AQAAAAAAADoAAEIgAcAGAAAAElQTS5NaWNy b3NvZnQgTWFpbC5Ob3RlADEIAQ2ABAACAAAAAgACAAEEkAYAEAIAAAEAAAAQAAAAAwAAMAIAAAAL AA8OAAAAAAIB/w8BAAAAYQAAAAAAAACBKx+kvqMQGZ1uAN0BD1QCAAAAAGRpeV9lZmlAZWZpMzMy LmVuZy5vaGlvLXN0YXRlLmVkdQBTTVRQAGRpeV9lZmlAZWZpMzMyLmVuZy5vaGlvLXN0YXRlLmVk dQAAAAAeAAIwAQAAAAUAAABTTVRQAAAAAB4AAzABAAAAIgAAAGRpeV9lZmlAZWZpMzMyLmVuZy5v aGlvLXN0YXRlLmVkdQAAAAMAFQwBAAAAAwD+DwYAAAAeAAEwAQAAACQAAAAnZGl5X2VmaUBlZmkz MzIuZW5nLm9oaW8tc3RhdGUuZWR1JwACAQswAQAAACcAAABTTVRQOkRJWV9FRklARUZJMzMyLkVO 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------ =_NextPart_000_01BE0E1D.B55C0620-- ------------------------------ From: Carlo Putter Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1998 09:36:25 +0200 Subject: RE: ? on Mr Hall Effect - ------ =_NextPart_000_01BE0E1F.EB01EEA0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Correction I am in the power electronics field and I assure you that there are = Transistors with gates. They are called IGBTs (Insulated Gate Bipolar Transistors). These = devices are very common is power electronics, reason: Good on state = charactaristics (High current [up to 3kA] low on-state voltage [<2.5V]), = High blocking voltage [recently 3.6kV], Easy turn on and of [mosfet = input characteristics]. The easy turn-on and off is the major advantage, if you ussed an BJT = that could conduct 3kA with Beta of 5 then you base current would be = 600A !!!! cool!!! what a large base drive circuit you need, not even to = think of the lossed in you circuit !!!! Cheers Carlo - -----Original Message----- From: Kevin Vannorsdel [SMTP:kv@xxx.com] Sent: Tuesday, November 10, 1998 8:50 PM To: diy_efi@xxx.edu Subject: RE: ? on Mr Hall Effect No dis-respect intended (absolutely no flame) but I can't let this one = slide... I work with transistors every day- never heard of a bipolar one with a = "gate" and certainly never heard of any transistor getting turned on by a = magnetic field (at least not one of practical magnitude). OK-- thyristors (SCR's and Triacs) may be considered bipolar devices = and do have terminals labeled "gate"--- I wouldn't call these things bipolar transistors though. Many electronic devices can be activated by an *electric* field and most certainly by light... (as is the case with the phototransistor (or any transistor)) Here is what "Physics" second Edition by Tipler says: - ----------------------- "The force exerted by a magnetic field on a current-carrying wire is = actually exerted directly on the charge carriers in the wire, the electrons. The = force is transferred to the wire by the forces which bind the electrons to the = wire at the surface. Since the charge carriers themselves experience the = magnetic force when a current-carrying wire is in a magnetic field, the carriers = are accelerated toward one side of the wire. This phenomenon, called the = Hall Effect, allows us to determine the sign of the charge on the = carrier...... It also provides a convenient method for measuring magnetic fields. " - ----------------------- The section goes on to discuss how you can measure this Hall effect (the = higher density of electrons at one edge of the conductor) by measuring the = voltage difference across the end of a flat bar carrying current in a magnetic = field. Note that there is no transient behavior here- only a presence of a = magnetic field and a current carrying conductor. Just in case anyone else was interested... comments invited. ________________________________________________ Kevin Vannorsdel IBM Arm Electronics Development 408-256-6492 Tie 276-6492 kv@xxx.com owner-diy_efi@xxx.edu on 11/10/98 10:16:12 AM Please respond to diy_efi@xxx.edu To: diy_efi@xxx.edu cc: Subject: RE: ? on Mr Hall Effect What I recall of Hall Effect devices: A bipolar transister Gate can be turned on by the presence of a magnetic field. The hardwired gate connection can be biased to alter the magnetic = "turn-on" threshold. Similar to a photo-transistor in operating theory. Regards, Tom Butler > -----Original Message----- > From: Kevin Vannorsdel [SMTP:kv@xxx.com] > Sent: Tuesday, November 10, 1998 12:43 PM > To: diy_efi@xxx.edu > Subject: Re: ? on Mr Hall Effect > > > I have no knowledge of this particular sensor but correct me if I am > wrong.... > The Hall Effect (proper) is not a transient thing right? My = recollection > is > that the Hall Effect occurs in the presence of a magnetic material... = not > only > in the "passing" of it. > > Time to dig out my Physics 203 book! > > ________________________________________________ > Kevin Vannorsdel IBM Arm Electronics Development > 408-256-6492 Tie 276-6492 kv@xxx.com > > > > owner-diy_efi@xxx.edu on 11/10/98 08:35:25 AM > Please respond to diy_efi@xxx.edu > To: diy_efi@xxx.edu > cc: diy_efi@xxx.edu > Subject: Re: ? on Mr Hall Effect > > > > > I think the teeth improve the magnetic coupling between the powered > coil and the signal coil. I would almost guess that the powered coil > was powered by something other than a DC signal. Basically the power > coil to the signal coil is a transformer and putting the metal near it > changes how the transformer acts and that is what is detected. > > I do not think a DVM would be able to detect the signal good enough. > There would be only one change when you moved it in closer, and that > would pass by the DVM way too fast to catch. > > All of those devices work on transients that are probably too fast to > catch with a DVM. If you have it, you may try feeding it into a sound > card and see what the wave really looks like. Also if you where > spinning the disk past the sensor you would be able to detect the > level out the output signal (average level) changing, but would owuld > not be able to detect any of the waveforms themselves. You might in > the case be able to put the DVM on HZ (if yours had this) and count > the number of teeth. > > Roger > > On Tue, 10 Nov 1998, Bruce Plecan wrote: > > > In the past, I done some trouble shooting with Hall Effect Devises. > > Now, for the first time I hooked a meter to one with it sitting on = the > > table. The one I'm starring at is a Toyota, it has a red lead, a = white > > lead, and a sheilded cable with ground. > > So being the Cone Shaped Hat Wearer that I am, I did the = following. > Using > > a 9v battery, I grounded it to the shell of the sensor > > applied + to the read lead, grounded the meter (DVM on V), > > hooked the meter's lead to the white wire, and then tested it. > > The test being held a gm crank disc near the tip of the toyota > > sensor. 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