DIY_EFI Digest Wednesday, 27 January 1999 Volume 04 : Number 063 In this issue: RE: Switch Pitch Re: Cubic Dollars Re: Switch Pitch Re: Non list-chasing ghosts. Re: Non list-chasing ghosts. Re: TPI on a 406 Re: Cubic Dollars Re: PROMs and Copyrights... Re: Switch Pitch Re: FW: Electronic timing advance Re: Switch Pitch Re: Switch Pitch Re: Switch Pitch (Caddy 8-6-4) Re: Switch Pitch (Caddy 8-6-4) Re: PROMs and Copyrights... Re: PROMs and Copyrights... Re: PROMs and Copyrights... Re: DFI, Batch Fire, and other myths Re: Methanol compatible Injectors & LM1949 BLCC5074 error codes Re: Crane Cams regular telephone number Re: Switch Pitch TH-400 (was something else) RE: Switch Pitch RE: Switch Pitch Re: Injector reference halp needed.. 92 Camaro ECM VSS Re: Cubic Dollars Re: Injector reference halp needed.. Re: Cubic Dollars Re: DFI, Batch Fire, and other myths Re: DFI, Batch Fire, and other myths More for the FTP.... Re: Switch Pitch (Caddy 8-6-4) Re: Cubic Dollars Re: Cubic Dollars See the end of the digest for information on subscribing to the DIY_EFI or DIY_EFI-Digest mailing lists. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Gwyn Reedy" Date: Tue, 26 Jan 1999 15:40:50 -0500 Subject: RE: Switch Pitch You learn a lot - I always figured the switch pitch was to help the Buick dealers who had been selling shiftless Dynaflow for 15 years. Since the only vehicle I had seen it on was a Buick Special (A-Body). By the way, toward the end of the DynaFlow era, how many vane positions could the converter be set to? Three at least. Or was it some kind of infinitely variable position? Interesting technology. I agree with the gent who wold like a variable pitch, locking converter. Would be quite handy. Gwyn Reedy Brandon, Florida mailto:mgr@xxx.com > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-diy_efi@xxx.edu > [mailto:owner-diy_efi@xxx.edu]On Behalf Of Jim Davies > Sent: Tuesday, January 26, 1999 12:34 PM > To: diy_efi@xxx.edu > Subject: Re: Switch Pitch > > > > > On Tue, 26 Jan 1999, Robert Harris wrote: > > > The switch pitch converter was used to replace low gear of the > four speed > > hydramatic transmission when GM upgraded the design to the > "Turbo-Hydromatic" > > and was available only with the 400 and only on the heavier cars. > > > > Not so much a starting gear as a "passing" gear. Nice smooth > "downshift" > > unlike shifting gears - so as to not disturb the passengers and simply > > smoothly allow a nice increase in power to swoop around the peasants. > > > VP convertors did give a noticeable diiference at lower speeds and they > were easily rewired to be switched low/high at will. Oddly enough, their > reason for existence was to reduce creep when idling in gear with the car > stopped. > > ------------------------------ From: bearbvd@xxx.net (Greg Hermann) Date: Tue, 26 Jan 1999 13:39:39 -0700 Subject: Re: Cubic Dollars >Scully agrees with that one Mulder. Yep--and remember that John Adams (yes, that one) argued that the Bill of Rights was unnecessary cuz "NO JURY WOULD EVER CONVICT ANYBODY UNDER AN UNREASONABLE, UNJUST LAW, ANYWAY!" Jury nullification was an accepted part of English (and thus American, unless you are from Louisiana) law from when the Magna Carta was signed until the Rockefellers, Carnegies, Mellons, Morgans, Harrimans, etc. told the gummint that it should henceforth be called "JURY LAWLESSNESS!!" The framers considered the jury of peers to be the ultimate check and balance in their newly designed system of government. Really, the law on this subject has NOT changed, they just try to tell us that it has!!! Jurors have the right to judge the law as well as the facts in any case before them! Think about it!! Regards, Greg > > >---Robert Harris wrote: >> >> The question of your rights to hack GM or other ECU's vs the >Manufacturers >> boil down to two words - Cubic Dollars. If or when it is >perceived by GM et >> al to be in GM's interest to end the practice, it will end. GM has >> historically crushed competition without regard to anything other >than it was >> good for GM. Count on it. >> >> Start with sheer absolute weight of lawyers - how many thousand can >you afford >> to defend with? Then if you do start to get an edge - how many cubic >> lobbyist can you afford? GM can and has had the law routinely >changed to suit >> GM. >> >> When it was in Bill Gates interest to crush OS-2, cheap counterfeit >windows >> flooded the market. Now that it is not - the software police are >out in force >> and MS openly states that it intends to have the 100,000 $ >prescribed by law >> fines levied on individuals to end the practice. Bill Gates can and >is taking >> everything including the house of anyone they catch. >> >> Before you start to whine and snivel about rights - think campaign >> contributions. How many bucks to how many Klintonian officials >campaigns can >> you fatten vs GM. Not fair? - who said GM or life or God was fair? >> >> And do not forget that the tax paid gnomes and drones of the evil >empire >> AmeriKa will gladly crush you with the full weight and force of law >if it >> pleases their masters. Think not - remember Janet Reno's barbecue >where 84 >> people found out what happens when thief religion was not BATF >approved. >> >> Am I cynical - absolutely. Do I disapprove - absolutely NOT. Do >it, enjoy >> the holiday - but don't be surprised when Cubic Dollars descend to >end the >> practice. >> >> 1963 Ford C-600 Prison Bus Conversion "Home" >> 1971 Lincoln Continental 460 "Christine" >> 1972 "Whale" Mustang awaiting transplant >> 1978 Dodge Long Bed Peeek Up "Bundymobile" >> >> Habaneros - not just for breakfast anymore >> > >_________________________________________________________ >DO YOU YAHOO!? >Get your free @xxx.com ------------------------------ From: "Gary Derian" Date: Tue, 26 Jan 1999 15:50:13 -0500 Subject: Re: Switch Pitch Reducing pumping losses at cruise is a key element in improving fuel economy. Some tricks like V-8,6,4 were complicated and had many control problems. Taller gearing achieved some improvements but dropping cruise rpm into the slip range of torque converters negated much of the improvements. At first, reducing converter stall speed was used but performance really suffered. The next development was a TCC which permitted a higher stall speed when needed but little or no slip during cruise. Once TCCs were available, overdrive automatics could be used to improve economy even more. Gary Derian >sounds like the new tc's have much more slippage, is that a correct >assumption?? and the lockup tc is an attemp to restore what was lost >( I was a mechanic at a bmw,saab,subaru dealer in the 80's and live in >car hell -> salted roads so I never got my hands on one of these) > >Pat Ford email: pford@xxx.com >QNX Software Systems, Ltd. WWW: http://www.qnx.com >(613) 591-0931 (voice) mail: 175 Terrence Matthews >(613) 591-3579 (fax) Kanata, Ontario, Canada K2M 1W8 ------------------------------ From: Shannen Durphey Date: Tue, 26 Jan 1999 16:05:32 -0500 Subject: Re: Non list-chasing ghosts. Yup, I caught it. Thanks. Found the phone # and address and forwarded it to the car owner, too. This is more of a hobby to me. With these antique stock cars, the guys want to run them "just like they were". Which means, in some cases, exact copies of the original parts, and the stories to go with them. I got interested in the stories, I'm playing with the numbers in desktop dyno, just trying to "see" what they were like. It's just for fun. Shannen Greg Hermann wrote: > > >I'm currently helping a guy put together an engine for an antique > >stock car. In the process, I've met several people who bragged about > >these cams. I'm curious about them now, and want to throw some > >numbers into my engine simulations. Seems like they were pretty hot, > >and now you don't even hear about RB. > > > >Since you're on the line, know of any reasonable sources for a set of > >fuelie heade? Gotta be straight plug. > >Shannen > > Hi Shannen--- > > Said it before, mebbe you missed it--RB is still in business, somewhere in > MD. Gotta phone # buried somewhere. Jim is well aware of newer tech stuff, > not a ghost or dinosaur at all. > > Regards, Greg > > > >EFISYSTEMS@xxx.com wrote: > >> > >> No offense intended Shannen,,,,, but what about newer lobe technology!!!!!! > >> -Carl Summers > >> ------------------------------ From: EFISYSTEMS@xxx.com Date: Tue, 26 Jan 1999 16:15:32 EST Subject: Re: Non list-chasing ghosts. Hi Shannen, If we're talking about some 461 casting double hump heads, you might be in luck....let me know... - -Carl Summers In a message dated 1/26/99 2:44:05 AM Pacific Standard Time, shannen@xxx.com writes: << Subj: Re: Non list-chasing ghosts. Date: 1/26/99 2:44:05 AM Pacific Standard Time From: shannen@xxx.com (Shannen Durphey) Sender: owner-diy_efi@xxx.edu Reply-to: diy_efi@xxx.edu To: diy_efi@xxx.edu I'm currently helping a guy put together an engine for an antique stock car. In the process, I've met several people who bragged about these cams. I'm curious about them now, and want to throw some numbers into my engine simulations. Seems like they were pretty hot, and now you don't even hear about RB. Since you're on the line, know of any reasonable sources for a set of fuelie heade? Gotta be straight plug. Shannen EFISYSTEMS@xxx.com wrote: > > No offense intended Shannen,,,,, but what about newer lobe technology!!!!!! > -Carl Summers > >> ------------------------------ From: "Charles Brooks" Date: Tue, 26 Jan 1999 16:20:07 -0500 Subject: Re: TPI on a 406 One thing your going to need is a TPI manifold off of an 85 or 86 engine, unless you're willing to do a little grinding on the four bolt holes in the middle that hold the manifold to the head. Charles Brooks - ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Monday, January 25, 1999 9:08 PM Subject: Re: TPI on a 406 >Just a short comment on yr 'picked up'TPI. I've gor an '87 TPI setup for the >exact same application. The donor car was an '87 Firebird 350 with a '165. > >AJL > ------------------------------ From: goflo@xxx.net Date: Tue, 26 Jan 1999 14:28:02 -0800 Subject: Re: Cubic Dollars FWIW, "jury nullification" is explicitly recognized in California's constitution. Nonetheless, the common practice is for judges to ask prospective jurors if they will follow the instructions of the court in matters of law. Those who refuse to agree to this are not allowed to serve. Jack Greg Hermann wrote: > Yep--and remember that John Adams (yes, that one) argued that the Bill of > Rights was unnecessary cuz "NO JURY WOULD EVER CONVICT ANYBODY UNDER AN > UNREASONABLE, UNJUST LAW, ANYWAY!" Jury nullification was an accepted part > of English (and thus American, unless you are from Louisiana) law from when > the Magna Carta was signed until the Rockefellers, Carnegies, Mellons, > Morgans, Harrimans, etc. told the gummint that it should henceforth be > called "JURY LAWLESSNESS!!" The framers considered the jury of peers to be > the ultimate check and balance in their newly designed system of > government. Really, the law on this subject has NOT changed, they just try > to tell us that it has!!! Jurors have the right to judge the law as well as > the facts in any case before them! Think about it!! ------------------------------ From: "Charles Brooks" Date: Tue, 26 Jan 1999 16:29:36 -0500 Subject: Re: PROMs and Copyrights... Yes the tables were arrived at by a long involved process. Just as the curve in the distributor was arrived at after long painstaking extensive testing. The only difference between the two is the method of achieving the curve. I spoke with the ex-patent attorney at work. He said basically the same thing as one of the previous posts. It all comes down to $MONEY$ IF GM decides that this is hurting their bottom line then they'll pursue it. He mentioned that in 15 years of working in Patent law he had seen *4* cases that money had not played an issue in. He stated that in almost all cases the person/organization that won the suit was the one with the money to keep the case in court the longest regardless of what the actual point of conflict in design was. Interesting, don't you think? Charles Brooks - ----- Original Message ----- From: Orin Eman To: Sent: Tuesday, January 26, 1999 2:54 AM Subject: Re: PROMs and Copyrights... > >> Actually, they are not modifying code... >> They are modifying look-up tables. There is no copyright or patent that >> covers timing curves, fuel curves etc... if there was, changing the advance >> weights in your old distributor ignition car would have been illegal. > >Perhaps not for a simple curve, but the tables in ECUs are generated >from extended testing of the engine and are not simple curves. > ------------------------------ From: Shannen Durphey Date: Tue, 26 Jan 1999 16:36:42 -0500 Subject: Re: Switch Pitch Pat Ford wrote: > > On Tue, 26 Jan 1999, Guenther,Max wrote: > > sounds like the new tc's have much more slippage, is that a correct > assumption?? and the lockup tc is an attemp to restore what was lost > ( I was a mechanic at a bmw,saab,subaru dealer in the 80's and live in > car hell -> salted roads so I never got my hands on one of these) > The tcc is an attempt to reduce 10% or so slippage present in the converter. Where is car hell located? Shannen ------------------------------ From: "Bruce Plecan" Date: Tue, 26 Jan 1999 17:15:41 -0500 Subject: Re: FW: Electronic timing advance Hmm, ya got me wondering now, cause mine wouldn't trigger very easy. Took 12v as I recall.. Also, the KS wouldn't it be very "spikish" in nature, rather than a square wave, unless the on duration was very short. Bruce >My results seem to be a little different then what you have found, but I'm >not done yet. My first step was to hook the knock sensor output up to the >scope and rap on it with a metal rod. It looks just like you would expect >from a microphone, with a max output of ~3v (with a 'good' strike). > >So, the ESC module is on the bench, +12v supply, scope on output, and >a function generator (sine wave), on the input. The ESC module is a HKM >from a '87 305 Chevy van. > >It appears as though the module responds mostly to a rapid change in signal. >Either a sudden increase in amplitude, or a sudden change in frequency. >It appears that the freq range need be in the 2KHz to 17.5 KHz range. > >I haven't found a 'sweet' spot that would cause a continuous knock signal >output. The max p-p volts input that I've been testing with is 2.5v. If I really >crank up the volts, I can get a continuous output at almost any input freq. > >For the curious amongst us, the circuit is built on a thin ceramic plate >using silk-screened on resisters, some SMD capacitors, and a single >SMD chip (18 pin). The board was 'encapsulated' with a clear jelly like >substance that cleaned off with a toothbrush. The resisters are laser >trimmed for value. > >BobR. > >Who at this point is thinking that verifying the above on another module >would be a good idea. No sense in doing all this with a module that might >be/is bad. > >Who is also thinking that a tape recording on a running auto, of the >knock sensor 'sounds' like something to try. > > >Bruce Plecan wrote: > >>At one time I had a dozen or so esc on the bench, what exactly do you need >>to know?. >>In crash testing them, using a 555 to generate the KS they all seemed to >>listen >>to 2 frequencies. >>If you want I think I got the diagrams for the 555s to generate the KS >>signals. >>The 555 generators kinda overwhelm the ESC so the results aren't terribly >>accurate, if your tuning them. >>Bruce > >BobR wrote: > >>>Who now has a 305 truck ESC module on the bench, trying to find >>>out the how/what/why/where of this unit. > > >-- > > ------------------------------ From: Alain Toussaint Date: Tue, 26 Jan 1999 18:03:59 -0500 (EST) Subject: Re: Switch Pitch > Where is car hell located? up from the usa-cnada border 'till north pole > Shannen > > Alain Toussaint Drummondville Quebec,Canada alaint@xxx.ca ------------------------------ From: bearbvd@xxx.net (Greg Hermann) Date: Tue, 26 Jan 1999 16:32:55 -0700 Subject: Re: Switch Pitch >Pat Ford wrote: >> >> On Tue, 26 Jan 1999, Guenther,Max wrote: >> >> sounds like the new tc's have much more slippage, is that a correct >> assumption?? and the lockup tc is an attemp to restore what was lost >> ( I was a mechanic at a bmw,saab,subaru dealer in the 80's and live in >> car hell -> salted roads so I never got my hands on one of these) >> >The tcc is an attempt to reduce 10% or so slippage present in the >converter. Where is car hell located? I always thought it was at Colorado Fuel & Iron Co. (CF&I Steel) in Pueblo, Colorado--where they make a lot of them into nails, spikes, and barbed wire!! :-) Regards, Greg >Shannen ------------------------------ From: AL8001@xxx.com Date: Tue, 26 Jan 1999 18:47:52 EST Subject: Re: Switch Pitch (Caddy 8-6-4) In a message dated 99-01-26 16:04:46 EST, gderian@xxx.net writes: < cut> > Some tricks like V-8,6,4 were complicated and had many control >problems. >From what I recall, the Caddy V8-6-4 (368 CID ?) wes doomed because of: early electronic systems couldn't keep up with the engine. The engine size was just too small, had they used the system on a 425, 472, or 501 CID engine it may of had a chance. BTW, the Caddy system used solenoids that pulled circular wedge plates under the rocker arm bolts. ( the rocker arms were the single bolt type) This let the rockers flop up and down leaving both valves closed. I'm pretty sure the FI system was TBI. It was definetly MAP. Harold ------------------------------ From: "Bruce Plecan" Date: Tue, 26 Jan 1999 19:59:40 -0500 Subject: Re: Switch Pitch (Caddy 8-6-4) - -----Original Message----- From: AL8001@xxx.com> To: diy_efi@xxx.edu> Subject: Re: Switch Pitch (Caddy 8-6-4) gderian@xxx.net writes: >< cut> >> Some tricks like V-8,6,4 were complicated and had many control >>problems. > >>From what I recall, the Caddy V8-6-4 (368 CID ?) wes doomed because of: >early electronic systems couldn't keep up with the engine. My recollection, was a poor design done cheaply, hoping later software would cure a hardware problem, needless to say none of it worked right. I still chuckle with the idea of Caddy having VD, variable displacement. To me it was like someone was pulling plug wires off as ya drove. Some folks thought it was seamless.,,,,,,,,,, Bruce > ------------------------------ From: dave.williams@xxx.us (Dave Williams) Date: Tue, 26 Jan 1999 19:29:00 -0500 Subject: Re: PROMs and Copyrights... - -> Actually, they are not modifying code... - -> They are modifying look-up tables. There is no copyright or patent - -> that covers timing curves, fuel curves etc... US and European copyright law doesn't distinguish between "code" and "data." ------------------------------ From: dave.williams@xxx.us (Dave Williams) Date: Tue, 26 Jan 1999 19:26:00 -0500 Subject: Re: PROMs and Copyrights... - -> > covers timing curves, fuel curves etc... if there was, changing the - -> advance > weights in your old distributor ignition car would have - -> been illegal. If it's a vehicle that falls under Federal smog regulations, changing the advance weights in the distributor *is* illegal. The Fed doesn't bother to enforce their own regs; they pressure the local governments into being the bad guys. In most states, changing tire size can be illegal. In my state, for example, you can run a taller tire than stock, but not a shorter one. Why? Nobody knows. Nobody enforces it, either. But it's there on the books should they decide to mess with you. ==dave.williams@xxx.us====================================== I've got a secret / I've been hiding / under my skin / | Who are you? my heart is human / my blood is boiling / my brain IBM | who, who? =================================== http://home1.gte.net/42/index.htm ------------------------------ From: Roger Heflin Date: Tue, 26 Jan 1999 20:35:49 -0600 (CST) Subject: Re: PROMs and Copyrights... On Tue, 26 Jan 1999, Dave Williams wrote: > > -> Actually, they are not modifying code... > -> They are modifying look-up tables. There is no copyright or patent > -> that covers timing curves, fuel curves etc... > > US and European copyright law doesn't distinguish between "code" and > "data." > The real question is could someone buy say 100 books, and modify a word and resell it? I don't think this would violate copyright, and under the same conditions buying a computer with the right to run a given set of code, and adjusting it, should also not be a copyright violaction. You have right to one copy, you only have 1 copy, you have just corrected/adjusted a byte. Now if you sold that to others that did not also have a legal license to run one copy (computer from someone else other than original prom writer) then you could be in trouble. Roger ------------------------------ From: John Andrianakis Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1999 01:00:37 +0200 Subject: Re: DFI, Batch Fire, and other myths Bruce Plecan wrote: > > Snip > , or is there still a low-battery injector > >pulse width correction? > > yes, in the few gm ecms, I've seen there has always been a v > correction table. > Snip > > Would anyone happen to know, an easy way to lie to the ecm to > actually test this?. Would something like a 1.0 ohm 10 watt > resistor in series with the key power on or does the memory > wire have to drop also?. > On diacom they show a fuel pump voltage, is that the same as > what is used on the voltage correction table?. > Cheers > Bruce Not a very good idea but you could disconnect the altenator and watch as bettery voltage went slowly downward. I havent even seen a gm ecu so I cant tell about the rest. John Andrianakis. ------------------------------ From: John Andrianakis Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1999 03:32:56 +0200 Subject: Re: Methanol compatible Injectors & LM1949 Greg Hermann wrote: > > >Hi all, > > > > 1. I'm searching methanol (M85) compatible injectors rated at 25 > >pounds/hour. If someone have a contact or a place where to find them, let > >me know. > > > Me too!!! Infact any info on methanol or ethanol compatible injectors, from > 25# on up would be of help. Bosch?? Rochester?? Siemens?? Denso?? Lucas?? > Detailed flow info (fuel/pressure/flow)??? > > Regards, Greg > > > > Hugo Villeneuve. You can check with Kinsler, tel +1 248 362 1145, fax +1 248 362 1032 and maybe RC Engineering at www.rceng.com. As far as I know all injectors will work with alcohols- maybe you will have to change the o-rings to EPR.? John Andrianakis. ------------------------------ From: trinity@xxx.net (Mike) Date: Tue, 26 Jan 1999 21:56:26 -0500 Subject: BLCC5074 error codes Was poking around in the BLCC5074 code recently uploaded (sorry...forgot the poster's name) and came across some malfunction codes I'm not familiar with. Does the poster (or anyone familiar with this Holden 5L V8 (non-Chevy) BLCC combination) know the related systems for the following codes: 17 19 26 (QDM fault maybe?) 27 36 (vacuum leak maybe?) 46 (VATS fail?) 56 57 66 72 There are a bunch of other codes in the PROM but they're not enabled in the masks. The ones above are enabled but I'm not positive what they do. For educational purposes only :) - -- Mike ------------------------------ From: GRUMPYNOMO@xxx.com Date: Tue, 26 Jan 1999 22:01:30 EST Subject: Re: Crane Cams regular telephone number if you are looking for Igniter systems from Crane Cams they can also be purchased at FCECLtd@xxx.com ------------------------------ From: Tom Sharpe Date: Tue, 26 Jan 1999 22:05:47 -0600 Subject: Re: Switch Pitch TH-400 (was something else) Gwyn Reedy wrote: > Was under the impression that you can't put a locking torque converter on a > TH-350 or 400 because there is some kind of mechanical device (rod or > sleeve) that is in the trans and activates the locking of the clutches in > the converter. Seems like it would have to be that or else some kind of slip > rings to get electricity into the converter to lock an electrical clutch. There are lockup versions of the 350 and 400 (I think) depending upon the year (late model). There were also some versions with very low stall converters for better mileage. If you need OD, the only reasonable choice is the 4L80 (or the 700R4 for less than 450 HP or so, some even recommend the 200. They are all lockup standard but can be fixed to run with a non-lockup converter. Regards Tom ------------------------------ From: Jim Davies Date: Tue, 26 Jan 1999 20:18:41 -0800 (PST) Subject: RE: Switch Pitch On Tue, 26 Jan 1999, Pat Ford wrote: > On Tue, 26 Jan 1999, Guenther,Max wrote: > > sounds like the new tc's have much more slippage, is that a correct > assumption?? and the lockup tc is an attemp to restore what was lost Yes, they can be looser than before because coupling-related slippage is covered by the clutch. First came the clutch, then came the higher stall speeds. In the old days, tcc problems were often dealt with by side cutting plier. Not a good idea anymore. ------------------------------ From: Jim Davies Date: Tue, 26 Jan 1999 20:24:34 -0800 (PST) Subject: RE: Switch Pitch On Tue, 26 Jan 1999, Gwyn Reedy wrote: > By the way, toward the end of the DynaFlow era, how many vane positions > could the converter be set to? Three at least. Or was it some kind of > infinitely variable position? > > I agree with the gent who wold like a variable pitch, locking converter. > Would be quite handy. > The VP convertor as used on TH400s and ST300s is a 3 element convertor with adjustable stator vane angles. The DynoFlush was a one-speed trans with a multi-element convertor [cant remember, about 5 elements, IIRC] it did have a switch pitch feature but it was hydraulically actuated. Not interchangeable... ------------------------------ From: "Bruce Plecan" Date: Tue, 26 Jan 1999 23:37:58 -0500 Subject: Re: Injector reference halp needed.. I got tired of the injectors flopping around so cable tied them into pairs, and the tied each pair to a yard stick, so all are manageable now. Rube Goldberg ain't got nothing on me........ Bruce ------------------------------ From: "Mike Pilkenton" Date: Tue, 26 Jan 1999 20:57:17 -0800 Subject: 92 Camaro ECM Could someone please help educate me on the 92 Camaro 3.1L V6 ECM program. I am new to the programming scene and don't really understand the ECM programs but I do do have a strong EE background. What I would like to learn is how to reprogram or program my own EEPROMs for this application. I remeber a message some time ago of someone offering this service to list members?? Can anybody give me a simple basic conversion of the ECM program so that I might learn how these programs work. Has anybody decoded the 92 Camaro 3.1L V6 program? Sorry for all the questions but I have to start somewhere. Mike ------------------------------ From: "Mike Pilkenton" Date: Tue, 26 Jan 1999 21:01:45 -0800 Subject: VSS Could someone tell me what functions the VSS signal might affect in the 92 3.1L V6 Camaro ECM. The motor/ECM came off a manual tranny car and my project car application won't have this signal available unless I install an aftermarket speed sensor. Do I need this signal? Mike V6 Opel GT ------------------------------ From: Raymond C Drouillard Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1999 00:08:47 -0500 Subject: Re: Cubic Dollars Greg, That is very interesting. Where can I get documentation on that fact? I am always interested in what the constitution REALLY says, rather than some of the more interesting interpretations that I have seen. The next time I am called to jury duty, I would like to have in my hands documentation that I have the right to judge the law as well as the defendant. That would keep me from being forced to convict someone of a crime that shouldn't exist. Of course, the real effect of such paperwork would probablly be to get me excused from the jury. I would need to find a way to keep that from happening. Ray Drouillard On Tue, 26 Jan 1999 13:39:39 -0700 bearbvd@xxx.net (Greg Hermann) writes: >>Scully agrees with that one Mulder. > >Yep--and remember that John Adams (yes, that one) argued that the Bill >of >Rights was unnecessary cuz "NO JURY WOULD EVER CONVICT ANYBODY UNDER >AN >UNREASONABLE, UNJUST LAW, ANYWAY!" Jury nullification was an accepted >part >of English (and thus American, unless you are from Louisiana) law from >when >the Magna Carta was signed until the Rockefellers, Carnegies, Mellons, >Morgans, Harrimans, etc. told the gummint that it should henceforth be >called "JURY LAWLESSNESS!!" The framers considered the jury of peers >to be >the ultimate check and balance in their newly designed system of >government. Really, the law on this subject has NOT changed, they just >try >to tell us that it has!!! Jurors have the right to judge the law as >well as >the facts in any case before them! Think about it!! > >Regards, Greg >> >> >>---Robert Harris wrote: >>> >>> The question of your rights to hack GM or other ECU's vs the >>Manufacturers >>> boil down to two words - Cubic Dollars. If or when it is >>perceived by GM et >>> al to be in GM's interest to end the practice, it will end. GM >has >>> historically crushed competition without regard to anything other >>than it was >>> good for GM. Count on it. >>> >>> Start with sheer absolute weight of lawyers - how many thousand can >>you afford >>> to defend with? Then if you do start to get an edge - how many >cubic >>> lobbyist can you afford? GM can and has had the law routinely >>changed to suit >>> GM. >>> >>> When it was in Bill Gates interest to crush OS-2, cheap counterfeit >>windows >>> flooded the market. Now that it is not - the software police are >>out in force >>> and MS openly states that it intends to have the 100,000 $ >>prescribed by law >>> fines levied on individuals to end the practice. Bill Gates can >and >>is taking >>> everything including the house of anyone they catch. >>> >>> Before you start to whine and snivel about rights - think campaign >>> contributions. How many bucks to how many Klintonian officials >>campaigns can >>> you fatten vs GM. Not fair? - who said GM or life or God was >fair? >>> >>> And do not forget that the tax paid gnomes and drones of the evil >>empire >>> AmeriKa will gladly crush you with the full weight and force of law >>if it >>> pleases their masters. Think not - remember Janet Reno's barbecue >>where 84 >>> people found out what happens when thief religion was not BATF >>approved. >>> >>> Am I cynical - absolutely. Do I disapprove - absolutely NOT. Do >>it, enjoy >>> the holiday - but don't be surprised when Cubic Dollars descend to >>end the >>> practice. >>> >>> 1963 Ford C-600 Prison Bus Conversion "Home" >>> 1971 Lincoln Continental 460 "Christine" >>> 1972 "Whale" Mustang awaiting transplant >>> 1978 Dodge Long Bed Peeek Up "Bundymobile" >>> >>> Habaneros - not just for breakfast anymore >>> >> >>_________________________________________________________ >>DO YOU YAHOO!? >>Get your free @xxx.com > > > ___________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] ------------------------------ From: "Clive Apps Techno-Logicals 416 510 0020" Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1999 00:50:07 -0500 (EST) Subject: Re: Injector reference halp needed.. > > I got tired of the injectors flopping around so cable tied them into pairs, > and the tied each pair to a yard stick, so all are manageable now. > Rube Goldberg ain't got nothing on me........ careful next thing you know you will be attaching them to spiral dowels with rope patterns and attaching gold leaf and ribbons then you would have to call it the MSFIS (Martha Stewart FI System) Clive ------------------------------ From: James Ballenger Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1999 01:23:15 -0500 Subject: Re: Cubic Dollars Oleg Gusev wrote: > More and more people today run Linux and even some big corporations > support Open Source Software. True. Too bad even more people are added to the microsoft army than are linux users. I attended one of my girlfriends lectures on freebsd, a unix os. The guy stood up there in complete monotone droning for 50 minutes about how to change directories and directory structure. Good god, you can learn the same thing in less than 5 min if you just jump in. If you are familiar with dos, the principles are similar. Everybody else was sleeping, but I was really close to cracking. Thank god I'm not in computer science. James Ballenger ------------------------------ From: James Ballenger Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1999 01:27:53 -0500 Subject: Re: DFI, Batch Fire, and other myths Shannen Durphey wrote: > Since this is a long term plan, it's subject to change. Right now I'm > thinking about the 730 ecm and factory related stuff. 'course it > depends on the final power level of the engine. It always seems to go up as you go along :-) > I need to do more efi swaps that require chip changes. One "practice" run will > involve > a 67 Chevelle, 7747 ecm, and Holley TBI. I am looking for a Holley TBI any leads would be great. Any will do, but I was leaning towards the projection 4di with o2 sensor. James Ballenger ------------------------------ From: James Ballenger Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1999 01:35:53 -0500 Subject: Re: DFI, Batch Fire, and other myths Greg Hermann wrote: > Did the rear have a crush sleeve for preload, or positive shims?? The > latter is a lot harder to do that to, conversions are usually available. I never even bothered to pull out the pinion to look. The was like .75" of play at the driveshaft side of the thing, it made me sick. I figured out why it all happened now though. The previous owner got the VR TH-400 and swapped it in, but the tranny musta been 1" or more longer than the previous tranny. When I got the car, the tranny mount wasn't bolted down and the threads were stripped. So I put a bolt on the other side and bolted the thing down, I didn't even think about it. I figured the last guy just forgot or something. Soon after my rear end went. So I guess that the driveshaft would buckle enough at the tailshaft and u-joints to soften the blow at the pinion. When I bolted it down, it must have just pounded the poor rear into oblivion. And I thought I was doing myself a favor by hooking up the mount, damn. James Ballenger ------------------------------ From: "Ross Myers" Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1999 17:45:28 +1100 Subject: More for the FTP.... Uploaded another Holden Bin, this one is also used for a 1994/95 5L V8 Auto. File - BMZC1766.BIN Regards Ross Myers ------------------------------ From: James Ballenger Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1999 01:51:19 -0500 Subject: Re: Switch Pitch (Caddy 8-6-4) AL8001@xxx.com wrote: > >From what I recall, the Caddy V8-6-4 (368 CID ?) wes doomed because of: > > early electronic systems couldn't keep up with the engine. My dad used to have one, '81 I think. In its early years, it would switch to 8 under load 6 under most conditions and 4 when cruising. I was VERY slow to make changes for conditions though. I was just old enough to sneak out with it. I learned to parallel park with that thing in D.C., what a job! I always wanted to take the thing to a demolition derby, but I think it was donated to charity. James Ballenger ------------------------------ From: EFISYSTEMS@xxx.com Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1999 02:45:38 EST Subject: Re: Cubic Dollars Hi All, Yes, exactly, in Calif. the judge instructs the jurors and if they agree together that someone is right or wrong the judge can overturn it by matter of "law" ..............it's disgusting. - -Carl Summers In a message dated 1/26/99 1:27:23 PM Pacific Standard Time, goflo@xxx.net writes: << Subj: Re: Cubic Dollars Date: 1/26/99 1:27:23 PM Pacific Standard Time From: goflo@xxx.net Sender: owner-diy_efi@xxx.edu Reply-to: diy_efi@xxx.edu To: diy_efi@xxx.edu FWIW, "jury nullification" is explicitly recognized in California's constitution. Nonetheless, the common practice is for judges to ask prospective jurors if they will follow the instructions of the court in matters of law. Those who refuse to agree to this are not allowed to serve. Jack Greg Hermann wrote: > Yep--and remember that John Adams (yes, that one) argued that the Bill of > Rights was unnecessary cuz "NO JURY WOULD EVER CONVICT ANYBODY UNDER AN > UNREASONABLE, UNJUST LAW, ANYWAY!" Jury nullification was an accepted part > of English (and thus American, unless you are from Louisiana) law from when > the Magna Carta was signed until the Rockefellers, Carnegies, Mellons, > Morgans, Harrimans, etc. told the gummint that it should henceforth be > called "JURY LAWLESSNESS!!" The framers considered the jury of peers to be > the ultimate check and balance in their newly designed system of > government. Really, the law on this subject has NOT changed, they just try > to tell us that it has!!! Jurors have the right to judge the law as well as > the facts in any case before them! Think about it!! >> ------------------------------ From: EFISYSTEMS@xxx.com Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1999 02:57:03 EST Subject: Re: Cubic Dollars I know this is non EFI but I have to say, awesome response Ray, learn and do.....it is truly the scope of what we all want......knowledge of what we don't know or realize and/or inhibiting people from taking it from us without a fight. 2 cents - -Carl Summers In a message dated 1/26/99 9:31:39 PM Pacific Standard Time, cosmic.ray@xxx.com writes: << Subj: Re: Cubic Dollars Date: 1/26/99 9:31:39 PM Pacific Standard Time From: cosmic.ray@xxx.com (Raymond C Drouillard) Sender: owner-diy_efi@xxx.edu Reply-to: diy_efi@xxx.edu To: diy_efi@xxx.edu Greg, That is very interesting. Where can I get documentation on that fact? I am always interested in what the constitution REALLY says, rather than some of the more interesting interpretations that I have seen. The next time I am called to jury duty, I would like to have in my hands documentation that I have the right to judge the law as well as the defendant. That would keep me from being forced to convict someone of a crime that shouldn't exist. Of course, the real effect of such paperwork would probablly be to get me excused from the jury. I would need to find a way to keep that from happening. Ray Drouillard >> ------------------------------ End of DIY_EFI Digest V4 #63 **************************** To subscribe to DIY_EFI-Digest, send the command: subscribe diy_efi-digest in the body of a message to "Majordomo@xxx. A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to subscribe to that instead, replace "diy_efi-digest" in the command above with "diy_efi".