DIY_EFI Digest Wednesday, 24 February 1999 Volume 04 : Number 130 In this issue: RE: Delco 808 ecu info needed Re: injector size and bin questions RE: Delco 808 ecu info needed Re: Saginaw fittings RE: TH-400 help RE: Saginaw fittings RE: Plasma Jet Ignition Re: Saginaw fittings Need Fuel Pump Help...fast.. MAF meters and open-loop. RE: ECM wiring harness help Plasma Jet Ignitition RE: Need Fuel Pump Help...fast.. RE: Need Fuel Pump Help...fast.. Re: DIY_EFI_WWW Re: Plasma Jet Ignitition Re: Saginaw fittings Re: MAF meters and open-loop. Re: MAF meters and open-loop. Re: Plasma Jet Ignitition Re: Saginaw fittings Re: MAF meters and open-loop. Re: MAF meters and open-loop. BCC ANLB from 7727 NOT EFI Just fyi: A call to action! Big Brother is at it again! RE: BCC ANLB from 7727 See the end of the digest for information on subscribing to the DIY_EFI or DIY_EFI-Digest mailing lists. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Wayne Macdonald Date: Wed, 24 Feb 1999 23:14:28 +1100 Subject: RE: Delco 808 ecu info needed - ------ =_NextPart_000_01BE604B.71C01520 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Can you get the GM part 34987 from GM or do I need to find the LM9044 ?, I have tried to find an LM9044 but nobody has them !. Wayne - ---------- From: Ludis Langens Sent: Tuesday, February 23, 1999 4:00 AM To: diy_efi@xxx.edu Subject: Re: Delco 808 ecu info needed Wayne Macdonald wrote: > You say that this is a standard NatSemi part ?, Do you have the NatSemi part number ?. > > >O2 sensor amplifier. This is a standard NatSemi part. > > U5 44188 ???? The O2 amp is GM part number 34987. The NatSemi part number is LM1964 (old) or LM9044 (new). I don't know what the 44188 chip does. - -- Ludis Langens ludis (at) cruzers (dot) com Mac, Fiero, & engine controller goodies: http://www.cruzers.com/~ludis/ - ------ =_NextPart_000_01BE604B.71C01520 Content-Type: application/ms-tnef Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 eJ8+IiQMAQaQCAAEAAAAAAABAAEAAQeQBgAIAAAA5AQAAAAAAADoAAEIgAcAGAAAAElQTS5NaWNy b3NvZnQgTWFpbC5Ob3RlADEIAQ2ABAACAAAAAgACAAEEkAYAYAEAAAEAAAAMAAAAAwAAMAIAAAAL AA8OAAAAAAIB/w8BAAAAYQAAAAAAAACBKx+kvqMQGZ1uAN0BD1QCAAAAAGRpeV9lZmlAZWZpMzMy LmVuZy5vaGlvLXN0YXRlLmVkdQBTTVRQAGRpeV9lZmlAZWZpMzMyLmVuZy5vaGlvLXN0YXRlLmVk dQAAAAAeAAIwAQAAAAUAAABTTVRQAAAAAB4AAzABAAAAIgAAAGRpeV9lZmlAZWZpMzMyLmVuZy5v aGlvLXN0YXRlLmVkdQAAAAMAFQwBAAAAAwD+DwYAAAAeAAEwAQAAACQAAAAnZGl5X2VmaUBlZmkz MzIuZW5nLm9oaW8tc3RhdGUuZWR1JwACAQswAQAAACcAAABTTVRQOkRJWV9FRklARUZJMzMyLkVO Ry5PSElPLVNUQVRFLkVEVQAAAwAAOQAAAAALAEA6AQAAAAIB9g8BAAAABAAAAAAAAAKcSAEEgAEA HgAAAFJFOiBEZWxjbyA4MDggZWN1IGluZm8gbmVlZGVkAEYJAQWAAwAOAAAAzwcCABgAFwAOABwA AwA0AQEggAMADgAAAM8HAgAYABcADQAGAAMAHQEBCYABACEAAAAwQTBENjlGNTgxQzdEMjExODBB NzAwMTA0QjY0RDU4NQDxBgEDkAYA0AQAABQAAAALACMAAAAAAAMAJgAAAAAACwApAAAAAAADAC4A AAAAAAMANgAAAAAAQAA5AFBC4znvX74BHgBwAAEAAAAeAAAAUkU6IERlbGNvIDgwOCBlY3UgaW5m byBuZWVkZWQAAAACAXEAAQAAABYAAAABvl/vOeD1aQ0Lx4ER0oCnABBLZNWFAAAeAB4MAQAAAAUA AABTTVRQAAAAAB4AHwwBAAAAFgAAAHdtY2RvbmFsQGh1dGNoLmNvbS5hdQAAAAMABhDUcft6AwAH EEoCAAAeAAgQAQAAAGUAAABDQU5ZT1VHRVRUSEVHTVBBUlQzNDk4N0ZST01HTU9SRE9JTkVFRFRP RklORFRIRUxNOTA0ND8sSUhBVkVUUklFRFRPRklOREFOTE05MDQ0QlVUTk9CT0RZSEFTVEhFTVdB WU5FAAAAAAIBCRABAAAAPAMAADgDAAAmBgAATFpGdYhG/t7/AAoBDwIVAqQD5AXrAoMAUBMDVAIA Y2gKwHNldO4yBgAGwwKDMgPGBxMCgyIzD3poZWwDIERs6mcCgzQTDX0KgAjPCdniOxefMjU1AoAK gQ2xwQtgbmcxMDMUIAsKSxLyDAFjAEAgQwOReUkIYCBnEgAgdBTwIBhHTSAKsQVAMzQ5ODg3IANS HXIFsWRv0CBJIG4J4GQdMB8gDmYLgB+RHVFMTTkwYDQ0ID8sHzERwHY9HWB0CIEfmAORIHVidckF QG5vBuBkeSEhBCAzHUEekCEuCoUKhVdhDnkfYCRsCvRsaTE44jAC0WktMSCwDfAM0LMncwtZMTYK oANgdAWQfQVALSmXCocoSwwwKRZGPQNhOiqeKRYMgiBgdWTvBAAgYBqRCfBzKj8rTQZglwIwLH8t i1QKUHNkJVDBIPBGZWJydQrAI5AkMjMg8DE5NLAgNDY6JxATcE0vLytNVG8nMW8tiy5weV8NwGlA CQeQbC4J8Gcub2hwaW8tcwGQKUA6EGTGdTVvMD51YmopUTePaS2LUmU9sEQVAAWgIPknADggBZAc 4AuAAhAfU+cJgCWfJqMzNigXFcIMAd8pFiVDBdAA0B8QbgdAH5DIPHdtRORAaCMQEbACLgWgbS5h dT4gWncpIjoKhUbAWRzRc78lUB0xOtAdMS6BLoFhSAA/AZAgAAsRB7A60AZgbWn7HaQg4UQfIBzC ITQdUUnbvG51BtAEkCDQJFY+R0c8Pk8SIBHwAIAFsWFt5wtQBpAIkS4gMzBIv0nL400nR6EgVTVP kFKZILDvJvBAUFO/UpU/VUEkbE+w/x1gTlFO8U/yHYZMpR4DT4OXS79Mwy6CTTSgNjQKhbIoBvBk KR7SIHUoH2BcdykkXR9ARPEnBUBr+yNAB+B3SGQdYFNkEbAFIP8fAQeQJF0pkCTGLltUP2MMOwpA LnIoOtBbcAUAdXr/BJBkUR8QZJIDcAqFRMEzsfUIkW8g8CZAYBqgC4AdYJ8FoAIwA2AVEEzhZ28E cB0IkHM9sCEgAkBwOi88L3dpUEZQZNRGUi9+/WQTLyRsQW9CfhvVKRYKhQUWwQBvUAMAEBAAAAAA AwAREAAAAABAAAcwEG+vCO9fvgFAAAgwEG+vCO9fvgEeAD0AAQAAAAUAAABSRTogAAAAAAMADTT9 NwAArlM= - ------ =_NextPart_000_01BE604B.71C01520-- ------------------------------ From: "Gary Derian" Date: Wed, 24 Feb 1999 08:08:40 -0500 Subject: Re: injector size and bin questions Yes. The Europeans have used kg force per square mm as pressure for many years. When ISO devised pressure to be a Pascal, one Newton per square meter, the Europeans came up with a bar as a convenient measure of pressure very close to what they were used to. One bar, one atmosphere, one kg/mm^2 are not equal but very close to each other. The Japanese still use kg/mm^2 and we Americans who use metric officially use kiloPascals, (kPa) but bar is becoming increasingly common. Gary Derian >Hit send too quick there-- 1 bar = 100 kPa, or = 100,000 Pascals, still >equal to 14.5 psi. > ------------------------------ From: Wen Yen Chan Date: Wed, 24 Feb 1999 08:27:19 -0500 Subject: RE: Delco 808 ecu info needed Try Newark electronics. Wen On Wed, 24 Feb 1999, Wayne Macdonald wrote: > Can you get the GM part 34987 from GM or do I need to find the LM9044 ?, I have tried to find an LM9044 but nobody has them !. > > Wayne > > ---------- > From: Ludis Langens > Sent: Tuesday, February 23, 1999 4:00 AM > To: diy_efi@xxx.edu > Subject: Re: Delco 808 ecu info needed > > Wayne Macdonald wrote: > > You say that this is a standard NatSemi part ?, Do you have the NatSemi part number ?. > > > > >O2 sensor amplifier. This is a standard NatSemi part. > > > U5 44188 ???? > > The O2 amp is GM part number 34987. The NatSemi part number is LM1964 > (old) or LM9044 (new). > > I don't know what the 44188 chip does. > > -- > Ludis Langens ludis (at) cruzers (dot) com > Mac, Fiero, & engine controller goodies: http://www.cruzers.com/~ludis/ > > > > ------------------------------ From: bearbvd@xxx.net (Greg Hermann) Date: Wed, 24 Feb 1999 06:59:20 -0700 Subject: Re: Saginaw fittings >Does anyone know of a source of "Saginaw to hose barb" or "Saginaw to AN" >fittings at less than $10 each ?? My local NAPA has good high pressure >fuel filters at under $10 but most of them have female Saginaw inlet/outlet >but no source for fittings. > >Any suggestions for low cost, high pressure, fuel filters with either hose >barbs or 45 degree SAE inlet/outlet fittings?? > >Thanks, >Bud Not low cost the first time, but replaceable element after that--Barry Grant Fuel Systems. Regards, Greg ------------------------------ From: Don.F.Broadus@xxx.com Date: Wed, 24 Feb 1999 08:00:24 -0600 Subject: RE: TH-400 help To use a TH 400 for Vehicle Speed Sensing (VSS) input to the ECM. Remove the 4 bolts holding the tail shaft housing. Remove the speedo drive gear from the output shaft. Install speed sensor gear (40 tooth) AC Delco part number 8655315. Reinstall the tail shaft. The speed sensor pick up can be purchased from AC Delco also but I don't have that part number. You will need to see if the output of the pick up (AC) can go directly into the PCM. You can buy a modulator control from B&M that is made for Turbo applications, its mechanical and adjustable . Don > -----Original Message----- > From: Shannen Durphey [SMTP:shannen@xxx.com] > Sent: Tuesday, February 23, 1999 8:43 PM > To: diy_efi@xxx.edu > Subject: Re: TH-400 help > > Possibly someone can :) > > Jennifer and Brock Fraser wrote: > > > > Possibly someone can help me with a TH-400 application. I haven't ever > had > > any dealings with these units, so I have a few questions... > > > > 1. The trans has a wire labeled "kickdown switch". What does this do, > and > > do you ground it or supply +12 to activate it? (I assume +12v, since > there > > are no other wires and grounding could be through the case) > > When you step on the throttle, it closes a switch supplying 12V to the > downshift solenoid. You get downshift. Like the kickdown cable on > other trans'. > > > > > 2. Does anyone see any problems with deleting the speedo sensor, since > the > > speedometer on my car takes its reading from the differential, and I'll > be > > using a manual transmission calibration with the PCM... (96 LT1) I > think > > the only thing that a manual cal uses the speedo for is idle speed, and > I > > can do without that. Error codes aren't a concern... > > > Deleting? Leaving disconnected, no. Removing it and leaving a gaping > hole, yes. > > > 3. There's a modulator on the side of the case. What does a modulator > do > > when it sees boost pressure? Should I use a check valve to block boost > from > > going to it? > > > Modulator adjusts line pressure to make shifts harder/softer with > more/less load. Also plays a part in determining which gear trans > downshifts to when throttle is stomped, and upshift points. If you > use a check valve, the line to the modulator needs to be vented so > vacuum isn't trapped in the line. Also, they make plugs to replace > the modulator. You might investigate this route. > > > 4. How do you adjust the wide open throttle shift points? I realize > that > > the trans must be disassembled. > > Modulator + governor springs. Look for a "Shift Kit" by TransGo, > there's goodies + good info there, and price is right. No > substitutions, either. Also try to get A1 Trans or B+M catalogues. I > can dig out some phone #'s for these guys tomorrow. > > > > > Thanks a lot, > > Brock > No problem. > Shannen ------------------------------ From: "Van Setten, Tim (AZ75)" Date: Wed, 24 Feb 1999 06:58:42 -0700 Subject: RE: Saginaw fittings > > > >Any suggestions for low cost, high pressure, fuel filters with either > hose > >barbs or 45 degree SAE inlet/outlet fittings?? > > > >Thanks, > >Bud > > Here are some that we use here in the Southwest, these are 3/8 hose barb in and out. Purolator F33165, Fram G-3870, and Deutsch FF506. Supposedly the Deutsch fuel filter is off a late model Chevy (cough) truck. Good luck. Tim. ------------------------------ From: "Van Setten, Tim (AZ75)" Date: Wed, 24 Feb 1999 07:33:01 -0700 Subject: RE: Plasma Jet Ignition > ---------- > From: Raymond C Drouillard[SMTP:cosmic.ray@xxx.com] > Reply To: diy_efi@xxx.edu > Sent: Monday, February 22, 1999 9:33 PM > To: diy_efi@xxx.edu > Cc: fanglers@xxx.com > Subject: Re: Plasma Jet Ignition > How efficient can we make the circuit that charges the capaciter? Even > if it's VERY efficient, it's going to suck down a significent fraction of > the output of a typical alternater. Of course, it'll only do that at > high RPMs. > > I think it would be best to design it so that each cylinder has its own > capaciter, charger, etc. I wouldn't try to feed all of this energy > through the dizzy gap. > > Lesee... we'll assume that we're going to charge the cap to 200 V. E = > .5 * C * V^2 (if I remember correctly <:-) ) That gives use a > capacitence of 50 microfarads. A flash capaciter ought to do the trick. > Just to confuse you a little more here, awhile back we re-engineered the MSD-6A and to generate each spark they used a fly-back configuration. There are a bunch of sparks depending on the "Timing Window", but to generate one spark, it takes 700us at 45 Amps at 14 Volts on the input to generate 550 Volts to dump into a 1uF cap. Then it takes 300 us to dump all the energy from the cap into the ignition coil. Hence, one spark every 1 ms. If you need more info, let me know.....Tim. ------------------------------ From: steve ravet Date: Wed, 24 Feb 1999 09:12:39 -0600 Subject: Re: Saginaw fittings The filter I use in my truck is from a '91 Caprice w/350. It's about "fist" sized, hose barbs on each end, and a nice mounting bracket on the side. Don't know a part number. - --steve "Van Setten, Tim (AZ75)" wrote: > > > > > > >Any suggestions for low cost, high pressure, fuel filters with either > > hose > > >barbs or 45 degree SAE inlet/outlet fittings?? > > > > > >Thanks, > > >Bud > > > > Here are some that we use here in the Southwest, these are 3/8 hose > barb in and out. Purolator F33165, Fram G-3870, and Deutsch FF506. > Supposedly the Deutsch fuel filter is off a late model Chevy (cough) truck. > Good luck. > Tim. - -- Steve Ravet steve.ravet@xxx.com Advanced Risc Machines, Inc. www.arm.com ------------------------------ From: "Kurek, Larry" Date: Wed, 24 Feb 1999 09:24:43 -0600 Subject: Need Fuel Pump Help...fast.. Guys: Sprung a leak in my Bosch fuel pump last night (I guess the O-ring seal on the top of the pump (crimp), dried out or something... In any case, I need a pump fast. This was the pump previously sold as an Accel up to 420 HP pump. Details areL Bosch 9 580 233 003 12v 450 (927) E3EF-9350 BA If anyone knows where I can pick one up...I'd appreciate it. Thanks! Larry ------------------------------ From: Daniel Houlton Date: Wed, 24 Feb 1999 08:51:31 -0700 (MST) Subject: MAF meters and open-loop. I have an Isuzu 2.6l engine that has a Hitachi EFI system using a hot-wire type of MAF. I've recently added a turbocharger to it and I'm noticing something a bit odd when I go to WOT. I'm using on of those Cyberdyne A/F ration monitors (uses an LM3914) with the 10 LEDs. When driving under boost (about 5 or 6 psi) if I keep the throttle under about 3/4, the meter shows a slightly rich condition. But somewhere just after 3/4 throttle, the meter drops completely off (full lean). It seems to act like an on/off switch for the meter. If I go past this spot in the throttle, it goes full lean. I then immediately back off slightly and it goes back to slightly rich. It does this consistently and repeatedly so I don't think it's a quirk in the meter. By moving the throttle up and down about 1/4" I can get the meter to basically flash on and off as it goes from slightly rich to full lean. This spot seems to be about where I expect the WOT switch would kick in and switch the computer to open-loop mode. Why would it go so lean though? I can understand the computer compensating for the boost through monitoring the O2 sensor, but why would open- loop mode screw up? The MAF meter is still measuring the air coming in so it seems the mixture in open-loop should still be pretty accurate. Does an MAF meter not measure accurately in turbocharged applications? The meter is upstream of the turbo BTW. thanks - --Dan houlster@xxx.com http://www.inficad.com/~houlster ------------------------------ From: "Ward Spoonemore" Date: Wed, 24 Feb 1999 08:15:04 -0800 Subject: RE: ECM wiring harness help ash on the line. W. > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-diy_efi@xxx.edu > [mailto:owner-diy_efi@xxx.edu]On Behalf Of Shannen > Durphey > Sent: Tuesday, February 23, 1999 10:14 PM > To: diy_efi@xxx.edu > Subject: Re: ECM wiring harness help > > > I'm intrigued. How'd ya come by the powerplant? > Shannen > > Ward Spoonemore wrote: > > > > MY 1999, 5.7l vortech is running swell on a 1227747 ECM in my > 1990 p/u, its > > a lot easer to deal with as a converion. > > Ward > > > ------------------------------ From: bob@xxx.com (Robert Harris) Date: Wed, 24 Feb 1999 16:25:40 GMT Subject: Plasma Jet Ignitition Why? - All spark ignition starts with a plasma phase. During this breakdown phase the "blast wave" created will exceed 10 to the 4th meters velocity at several hundred atmospheres pressure. This injects a cloud of hyper temperature ~60,000k free radicals into the combustible mixture. As the electrodes heat up and the conductance falls, the spark transitions into an arc, where the expanding velocity drops to below local sonic and the temperature falls to ~6000 k. The energy transfer heat is primarily conduction to the combustible mixture. Increasing the size of the Plasma phase of ANY spark ignition results in greater quantity and penetration of free radicals into the combustible mixture. The larger the cloud of free radicals expelled during the Plasma breakdown, the faster and surer the ignition. Translation - less advance needed, faster flame front generation. More power, more tolerance to the cyclic F/A variations - particularly those seen by the sparking device. There are literally hundreds of patents which I am patiently wading thru, but there has been a lot of thought on this. In a conventional ignition system, most of the energy is disapated in the arc and glow stage, yet the Plasma stage determines most of the ignition characteristics. ANY design that pumps more energy into the plasma portion will increase the size of the cloud and result in better performance. And while the lab researchers try to reach 1 joule to virtually flood the main chamber and cause near instantaneous combustion ***** NOT DETONATION **** , I would be quite content to pump as much as practical into the plasma stage and suffer with only greatly extended mixture range, elimination of misfire and near TDC timing. How much is helpful? Depending on the ignition design, only up to about 2 % of the total sparking energy is consumed in the Plasma phase. Simply using another CD box triggered and rigged by a diode stack to fire into the first and modified to quickly dump its energy could potentially increase the plasma energy 50 fold if it could dump fast enough. >From the reading of the patents and others, simply shielding the spark in a pre chamber reduces the energy needed to fire an order of magnitude ( why anti-fouler improve ignition ) Combining any small pre chamber with a pumped up plasma ignition should result in nice increase's in power and mixture range. Also, the patents mention controls on when to plasma pump and when not to - just to reduce the electrical loss's to the system. And yes, there is also discussion of reducing the resultant emi. 1963 Ford C-600 Prison Bus Conversion "Home" 1971 Lincoln Continental 460 "Christine" 1972 "Whale" Mustang awaiting transplant 1978 Dodge Long Bed Peeek Up "Bundymobile" Habaneros - not just for breakfast anymore ------------------------------ From: "Falb, John" Date: Wed, 24 Feb 1999 10:48:27 -0600 Subject: RE: Need Fuel Pump Help...fast.. Kinsler 248-362-1145 They sell all kinds of efi stuff and there prices are pretty good. They should have all bosch pumps in stock. John Falb - -----Original Message----- From: Kurek, Larry [mailto:lkurek@xxx.gov] Sent: Wednesday, February 24, 1999 7:25 AM To: 'diy_efi@xxx.edu' Subject: Need Fuel Pump Help...fast.. Guys: Sprung a leak in my Bosch fuel pump last night (I guess the O-ring seal on the top of the pump (crimp), dried out or something... In any case, I need a pump fast. This was the pump previously sold as an Accel up to 420 HP pump. Details areL Bosch 9 580 233 003 12v 450 (927) E3EF-9350 BA If anyone knows where I can pick one up...I'd appreciate it. Thanks! Larry ------------------------------ From: "Van Setten, Tim (AZ75)" Date: Wed, 24 Feb 1999 10:07:19 -0700 Subject: RE: Need Fuel Pump Help...fast.. > ---------- > From: Kurek, Larry[SMTP:lkurek@xxx.gov] > Reply To: diy_efi@xxx.edu > Sent: Wednesday, February 24, 1999 8:24 AM > To: 'diy_efi@xxx.edu' > Subject: Need Fuel Pump Help...fast.. > > Guys: > > Sprung a leak in my Bosch fuel pump last night (I guess the O-ring seal > on > the top of the pump (crimp), dried out or something... > > In any case, I need a pump fast. This was the pump previously sold as an > Accel up to 420 HP pump. Details areL > > Bosch > 9 580 233 003 > 12v 450 (927) > E3EF-9350 BA > > > If anyone knows where I can pick one up...I'd appreciate it. > > Thanks! > > Larry Be careful here Larry, my experience here says use ONLY a Bosch pump! Don't use any other brand because you get what you pay for (volume of fuel at what pressure?). If you want a used pump from a junk yard for about $10.00, get one off of a VW Rabbit. It is one of the biggest Bosch pump out there. If you want new, find a Bosch distributor in your area and get a GFP-216, about $200.00. I was also told that NAPA carries one for about $150.00 that comes off of a late model Corvette. Good luck...Tim. ------------------------------ From: steve ravet Date: Wed, 24 Feb 1999 11:16:33 -0600 Subject: Re: DIY_EFI_WWW Lots of people have been asking about this. The article is back online, thanks to Mr. Packrat Terry Sare. - --steve DAVE wrote: > > Would you happen to have a copy of the DIS project from Performance > Engineering Magazine that you could send me? It seems that the link on > the DIY- EFI site is dead. > > Thanks in advance, Dave C. - -- Steve Ravet steve.ravet@xxx.com Advanced Risc Machines, Inc. www.arm.com ------------------------------ From: Wen Yen Chan Date: Wed, 24 Feb 1999 12:23:31 -0500 Subject: Re: Plasma Jet Ignitition Hello, Just a thought.... why not add a small HV capacitor in parallel with a non resistor plug (using a low inductance path) and switch the ignition wires to solid conductor types. When the normal ignition system fires the HV cap would charge 'slowly' to the breakdown voltage of the gap and dump its charge really quickly. The speed at which we could dump the charge through the plug would not be limited by the inductance of the spark plug wires or the leakage inductance of the ignition coils. Wen On Wed, 24 Feb 1999, Robert Harris wrote: > Why? - All spark ignition starts with a plasma phase. During this breakdown > phase the "blast wave" created will exceed 10 to the 4th meters velocity at > several hundred atmospheres pressure. This injects a cloud of hyper > temperature ~60,000k free radicals into the combustible mixture. As the > electrodes heat up and the conductance falls, the spark transitions into an > arc, where the expanding velocity drops to below local sonic and the > temperature falls to ~6000 k. The energy transfer heat is primarily > conduction to the combustible mixture. > > Increasing the size of the Plasma phase of ANY spark ignition results in > greater quantity and penetration of free radicals into the combustible > mixture. The larger the cloud of free radicals expelled during the Plasma > breakdown, the faster and surer the ignition. Translation - less advance > needed, faster flame front generation. More power, more tolerance to the > cyclic F/A variations - particularly those seen by the sparking device. > > There are literally hundreds of patents which I am patiently wading thru, but > there has been a lot of thought on this. > > In a conventional ignition system, most of the energy is disapated in the arc > and glow stage, yet the Plasma stage determines most of the ignition > characteristics. ANY design that pumps more energy into the plasma portion > will increase the size of the cloud and result in better performance. And > while the lab researchers try to reach 1 joule to virtually flood the main > chamber and cause near instantaneous combustion ***** NOT DETONATION **** , I > would be quite content to pump as much as practical into the plasma stage and > suffer with only greatly extended mixture range, elimination of misfire and > near TDC timing. > > How much is helpful? Depending on the ignition design, only up to about 2 % > of the total sparking energy is consumed in the Plasma phase. Simply using > another CD box triggered and rigged by a diode stack to fire into the first > and modified to quickly dump its energy could potentially increase the plasma > energy 50 fold if it could dump fast enough. > > >From the reading of the patents and others, simply shielding the spark in a > pre chamber reduces the energy needed to fire an order of magnitude ( why > anti-fouler improve ignition ) Combining any small pre chamber with a pumped > up plasma ignition should result in nice increase's in power and mixture > range. Also, the patents mention controls on when to plasma pump and when not > to - just to reduce the electrical loss's to the system. And yes, there is > also discussion of reducing the resultant emi. > > > > > 1963 Ford C-600 Prison Bus Conversion "Home" > 1971 Lincoln Continental 460 "Christine" > 1972 "Whale" Mustang awaiting transplant > 1978 Dodge Long Bed Peeek Up "Bundymobile" > > Habaneros - not just for breakfast anymore > ------------------------------ From: Shannen Durphey Date: Wed, 24 Feb 1999 12:26:31 -0500 Subject: Re: Saginaw fittings Are you sure those aren't quick connect fittings? One ridge on the fitting, about 1/4" from the end? Shannen steve ravet wrote: > > The filter I use in my truck is from a '91 Caprice w/350. It's about > "fist" sized, hose barbs on each end, and a nice mounting bracket on the > side. Don't know a part number. > > --steve > ------------------------------ From: "Gary Derian" Date: Wed, 24 Feb 1999 12:59:15 -0500 Subject: Re: MAF meters and open-loop. Have you saturated the meter? Gary Derian >This spot seems to be about where I expect the WOT switch would >kick in and switch the computer to open-loop mode. Why would it >go so lean though? I can understand the computer compensating for >the boost through monitoring the O2 sensor, but why would open- >loop mode screw up? The MAF meter is still measuring the air >coming in so it seems the mixture in open-loop should still be >pretty accurate. > >Does an MAF meter not measure accurately in turbocharged >applications? The meter is upstream of the turbo BTW. > > >thanks >--Dan >houlster@xxx.com >http://www.inficad.com/~houlster ------------------------------ From: Chris Conlon Date: Wed, 24 Feb 1999 14:19:08 -0500 Subject: Re: MAF meters and open-loop. At 08:51 AM 2/24/99 -0700, Daniel Houlton wrote: >LM3914) with the 10 LEDs. When driving under boost (about 5 or 6 >psi) if I keep the throttle under about 3/4, the meter shows a >slightly rich condition. But somewhere just after 3/4 throttle, >the meter drops completely off (full lean). Without going into a lot more detail... Partial/slight/intermittent rich misfire? Timing very retarded, due to WOT switch or knock sensor? Other possibly helpful diagnostic details: Does the engine still make good power under this condition? Do you get detonation / do you have a knock sensor? Does your turbo manifold glow red after a hard run? Chris C. ------------------------------ From: bearbvd@xxx.net (Greg Hermann) Date: Wed, 24 Feb 1999 12:27:13 -0700 Subject: Re: Plasma Jet Ignitition >Hello, > >Just a thought.... why not add a small HV capacitor in parallel with a non >resistor plug (using a low inductance path) and switch the ignition wires >to solid conductor types. When the normal ignition system fires the HV cap >would charge 'slowly' to the breakdown voltage of the gap and dump its >charge really quickly. The speed at which we could dump the charge through >the plug would not be limited by the inductance of the spark plug wires >or the leakage inductance of the ignition coils. > >Wen I think I saw a web site a few months ago where somebody is selling plug mount capacitors-- Greg > >On Wed, 24 Feb 1999, Robert Harris wrote: > >> Why? - All spark ignition starts with a plasma phase. During this breakdown >> phase the "blast wave" created will exceed 10 to the 4th meters velocity at >> several hundred atmospheres pressure. This injects a cloud of hyper >> temperature ~60,000k free radicals into the combustible mixture. As the >> electrodes heat up and the conductance falls, the spark transitions into an >> arc, where the expanding velocity drops to below local sonic and the >> temperature falls to ~6000 k. The energy transfer heat is primarily >> conduction to the combustible mixture. >> >> Increasing the size of the Plasma phase of ANY spark ignition results in >> greater quantity and penetration of free radicals into the combustible >> mixture. The larger the cloud of free radicals expelled during the Plasma >> breakdown, the faster and surer the ignition. Translation - less advance >> needed, faster flame front generation. More power, more tolerance to the >> cyclic F/A variations - particularly those seen by the sparking device. >> >> There are literally hundreds of patents which I am patiently wading thru, but >> there has been a lot of thought on this. >> >> In a conventional ignition system, most of the energy is disapated in the arc >> and glow stage, yet the Plasma stage determines most of the ignition >> characteristics. ANY design that pumps more energy into the plasma portion >> will increase the size of the cloud and result in better performance. And >> while the lab researchers try to reach 1 joule to virtually flood the main >> chamber and cause near instantaneous combustion ***** NOT DETONATION **** , I >> would be quite content to pump as much as practical into the plasma stage and >> suffer with only greatly extended mixture range, elimination of misfire and >> near TDC timing. >> >> How much is helpful? Depending on the ignition design, only up to about 2 % >> of the total sparking energy is consumed in the Plasma phase. Simply using >> another CD box triggered and rigged by a diode stack to fire into the first >> and modified to quickly dump its energy could potentially increase the plasma >> energy 50 fold if it could dump fast enough. >> >> >From the reading of the patents and others, simply shielding the spark in a >> pre chamber reduces the energy needed to fire an order of magnitude ( why >> anti-fouler improve ignition ) Combining any small pre chamber with a >>pumped >> up plasma ignition should result in nice increase's in power and mixture >> range. Also, the patents mention controls on when to plasma pump and >>when not >> to - just to reduce the electrical loss's to the system. And yes, there is >> also discussion of reducing the resultant emi. >> >> >> >> >> 1963 Ford C-600 Prison Bus Conversion "Home" >> 1971 Lincoln Continental 460 "Christine" >> 1972 "Whale" Mustang awaiting transplant >> 1978 Dodge Long Bed Peeek Up "Bundymobile" >> >> Habaneros - not just for breakfast anymore >> ------------------------------ From: steve ravet Date: Wed, 24 Feb 1999 13:39:04 -0600 Subject: Re: Saginaw fittings Shannen Durphey wrote: > > Are you sure those aren't quick connect fittings? One ridge on the > fitting, about 1/4" from the end? > Shannen Ummmmm..... Guess that shows how much I know about fittings. As I recall it's a steel tube coming from both ends of the filter, with a little bubble or ridge around the tube, about 1/4" from the end. Assumed that was called hose barb, and the ridge was to keep the hose clamp on. - --steve > > steve ravet wrote: > > > > The filter I use in my truck is from a '91 Caprice w/350. It's about > > "fist" sized, hose barbs on each end, and a nice mounting bracket on the > > side. Don't know a part number. > > > > --steve > > - -- Steve Ravet steve.ravet@xxx.com Advanced Risc Machines, Inc. www.arm.com ------------------------------ From: Daniel Houlton Date: Wed, 24 Feb 1999 13:11:09 -0700 (MST) Subject: Re: MAF meters and open-loop. Chris Conlon wrote: > > At 08:51 AM 2/24/99 -0700, Daniel Houlton wrote: > > >LM3914) with the 10 LEDs. When driving under boost (about 5 or 6 > >psi) if I keep the throttle under about 3/4, the meter shows a > >slightly rich condition. But somewhere just after 3/4 throttle, > >the meter drops completely off (full lean). > > Without going into a lot more detail... > Partial/slight/intermittent rich misfire? Can't tell if there's a misfire. Power doesn't change at all and it doesn't stumble or cough. > Timing very retarded, due to WOT switch or knock sensor? No knock sensor so it can't be that. Timing isn't retarded at all and I'm pretty sure that the WOT doesn't cause it to do so. I will need to check the manual on that one to make sure. > > Other possibly helpful diagnostic details: > Does the engine still make good power under this condition? Yup, power doesn't drop off. Only indication it get is the A/F meter. > Do you get detonation / do you have a knock sensor? No detonation or pinging that I can hear of feel. No knock sensor. > Does your turbo manifold glow red after a hard run? Hmm. Don't know. I will have to check this one. The manifold and turbine scroll housing are ceramic coated. Will they still glow like this? Also, the down pipe out of the turbine is a double wall type all the way to the cat convertor so that won't really be obvious if it is glowing. > > Chris C. Thanks for the ideas. I'll check after dark to see if the manifold is glowing at all. Any more? thanks - --Dan ------------------------------ From: Daniel Houlton Date: Wed, 24 Feb 1999 13:17:22 -0700 (MST) Subject: Re: MAF meters and open-loop. Gary Derian wrote: > > Have you saturated the meter? > Haven't been monitoring the output of the meter, but now that you mention it, that very well could be it. If the meter is saturated, then it's not giving an accurate measurement and I could be ingesting a lot more air than the meter says. Closed- loop could make up for this but the moment it goes to open loop, it becomes too lean. I'll hook up a meter and watch this. Also, I did monitor my MAF once before I had the turbo on and it seemed to put out a voltage signal based on load between 1 and 5 volts with 5 being the highest load voltage. So maybe it is stopping at 5 volts and can't go any higher with more air flowing through it? - --Dan ------------------------------ From: Doug Mansfield Date: Wed, 24 Feb 1999 15:29:50 -0500 Subject: BCC ANLB from 7727 Can anyone easily tell me what car this ECM came from: Service Number: 1227727 Broadcast Code: ANLB Other numbers on the ECM case: 865751 M812076168 16125751 Thanks Doug Mansfield ------------------------------ From: Terry_Sare@xxx.com Date: Wed, 24 Feb 1999 15:24:35 -0600 Subject: NOT EFI Just fyi: A call to action! Big Brother is at it again! > This is getting WAY out of hand... How much more personal invasion is it > going to take before we all find that government has finally become a > totalitarian regime? > The only new regulations we need at this time are regulations to get these > overbearing out-of-control regulatory agencies out of our lives. > > > Forwarded to me from a concerned friend. > Unbelieveable-not so. Read about this in Investors Business Daily also. > Really frightening. The new world order police are on there way. Please > speak out. ~Nancy > New Banking Regs, No Joke! > I'm not in the habit of sending "serious" e-mails asking people to get > involved. However, I just found out about a proposed banking regulation > up for consideration that seriously intrudes on our private lives. It's so > intrusive, I've decide to speak up and send this to you, in hopes that > you'll act on it, and forward it to as many people as you can. You only > have until March 8th to voice your objections. In 1998, a "Know Your > Customer" banking Bill was defeated in the House of Representatives. The > federal government, namely the FDIC and Treasury, quietly took the > regulation and decided to implement it without congressional approval. It > has silently made it's way to the public comment phase, and very few > people (including many of your representatives, bank employees, etc.) are > even aware it's out there. > If implemented, this regulation will have a significant and far reaching > affect on your everyday life. Here are a just few of the highlights of the > proposed "Know Your Customer" regulation. I've included a link below that > has all the details (this is only the small part of the regulation). Bank > customers (you) will be required to reveal all sources of revenue (income) > that you deposit in the bank. Accounts will be monitored to evaluate > actual deposits compared with projections. You must provide them with > your projected income and sources. Banks will establish profiles, > classifications, and categorizations on every person who has an account > based on information supplied by the customer (you) and other gathered > information. All customers will be compared against the subjective > classifications. > Perceived anomalies in deposits or withdrawals (that means any time your > spending habits change, even for a day) will be reported as "suspicious > activity." In short, the u that identifies when and how you usually > receive and spend your money. If you normally withdraw $100 from the ATM > every Friday night, that will be part of your profile. If you decide one > Friday to withdraw $700 for a weekend trip or to make a purchase, you will > have deviated from your normal spending pattern, and the bank will be > required to file a suspicious transaction report to the federal > government. Banks are prohibited from informing customers when suspicious > transaction reports have been filed on them. > If you do not "volunteer" to be identified, you will be denied all banking > services. If you believe in your 4th Amendment right privacy, I urge you > to read the specifics below, and contact the agencies listed at the bottom > of this message with your strong objections. This is your only chance to > stop the regulation. Public comments will only be accepted through March > 8th. > Here the complete details of what the regulation includes-it's worth your > time to read it: > http://www.networkusa.org/fingerprint/page1b/fp-kyc-summary.html > http://www.networkusa.org/fingerprint/page1b/fp-kyc-summary.html> > Comments will be taken from the public by these agencies until March 8, > 1999. Federal Deposit Insurance Corporation Robert E. Feldman Executive > Secretary Attention: Comments/OES comments@xxx.gov > mailto:comments@xxx.gov> or Department of the Treasury Manager, > Dissemination Branch Information Management and Services Division > Office of Thrift Supervision public.info@xxx.gov < > mailto:public.info@xxx.gov> Department of the Treasury > Communications Division Office of the Comptroller of the Currency > regs.comments@xxx.gov > mailto:regs.comments@xxx.gov> > If your so inclined, find out who your Representatives are, and e-mail > your concerns to them as well. > > > > ------------------------------ From: "Ward Spoonemore" Date: Wed, 24 Feb 1999 13:50:08 -0800 Subject: RE: BCC ANLB from 7727 1989 w car, 2.8L, me9 transmission, federal emmissions Ward. > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-diy_efi@xxx.edu > [mailto:owner-diy_efi@xxx.edu]On Behalf Of Doug > Mansfield > Sent: Wednesday, February 24, 1999 12:30 PM > To: Do-it-Yourself Fuel Injection Mailing List > Subject: BCC ANLB from 7727 > > > > Can anyone easily tell me what car this ECM came from: > > Service Number: 1227727 > Broadcast Code: ANLB > > Other numbers on the ECM case: > 865751 M812076168 > 16125751 > > Thanks > > Doug Mansfield > ------------------------------ End of DIY_EFI Digest V4 #130 ***************************** To subscribe to DIY_EFI-Digest, send the command: subscribe diy_efi-digest in the body of a message to "Majordomo@xxx. 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