DIY_EFI Digest Sunday, April 4 1999 Volume 04 : Number 208 In this issue: Re: '50s MOPAR Hemi question Re: Injector driver question... Re: Toyota Supra twin turbo and water injection. Re: '50s MOPAR Hemi question RE: Camshafts Re: 73 Chevy v8 question Re: ABS Wheel sensor signal generator Re: '50s MOPAR Hemi question Re: Injector driver question... 7-Pin HEI Module 1227148 Re: '50s MOPAR Hemi question Re: '50s MOPAR Hemi question Re: 1227148 7730 ECM RE: identifying a Chevy 350 block and Trans Re: Toyota Supra twin turbo and water injection. Re: 7-Pin HEI Module Re: 1227148 ERL water pump Re: ABS Wheel sensor signal generator Water injectin: How much? Or maybe propane? See the end of the digest for information on subscribing to the DIY_EFI or DIY_EFI-Digest mailing lists. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sat, 3 Apr 1999 17:08:49 EST From: WLundquist@xxx.com Subject: Re: '50s MOPAR Hemi question The KD500 designation indicates that it is a 325 C.I.D. Hemi engine, however, the 2-4bbl was an option. The D500 is a 315 C.I.D. Hemi engine used in 1956. The KD500 was a 285 H.P. with a single 4 bbl and 310 H.P. with the 2-4's and the KD prefix indicates Dodge. Hope this helps. If you want more info check out Hemi Muscle annual issue 1998. McMullen Argus Publishing, Inc. Wayne ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 03 Apr 1999 19:23:45 -0300 From: Ricardo Seixas Subject: Re: Injector driver question... Hugo Wrote: > >For my test setup, I used a digital storage oscilloscope with a probe >directly between the 0.1 Ohms sense resistor to measure the current of the >injector, like the LM1949 is doing! . The input signal was at 50% duty >cycle, with a frequency of 83 Hz (5000 RPM). > > Hugo. I guess that the frequency should be half that. 5000/60 = 83.33 rps / 2 (4stroke) = 41.67 Hz. Or Am I wrong ? Ricardo Seixas ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 3 Apr 1999 16:14:27 -0700 From: bearbvd@xxx.net (Greg Hermann) Subject: Re: Toyota Supra twin turbo and water injection. >In article <4.1.19990403143820.00951540@xxx. >Cooley apparently wrote: > >> How about substituting Methanol or Ethanol for the water... higher heat of >> vaporization (cools better as it evaporates) Plus it supplies additional >> fuel to the engine *AND* increases effective octane of the cylinder >> charge... Pretty good gains to be seen here if it's metered right! > >That is pretty common over here in the UK.I do not know if such additives >would be "liked" by the Lambda sensor though? Anyone ? No problem there--fact is, the sensor will read the true stoich point, despite the new fuel. Greg > > > >-- > Best Regards, > Chris Wilson. > http://www.maximum-bhp.u-net.com ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 3 Apr 1999 18:22:34 EST From: Tedscj@xxx.com Subject: Re: '50s MOPAR Hemi question In a message dated 4/3/99 4:58:49 PM Eastern Standard Time, clare.snyder.on.ca@xxx.net writes: > Does your 325 have solid or hydraulic lifters? The hydraulic lifter > engine was standard on the Royal Custom - solids made it a D500 .Super > D500 had dual quads and solids. > The D501 was the 354 cid engine with hydraulics and dual 4BBls. > All were Hemis. > > If this is a DODGE engine, not Chrysler od Desoto, you can be sure this > is correct. I think I have the same source of information as James (Standard Catalog of American Autos). It basically says that Coronet, Royal and Custom Royals come with a "KDS" engine and the D500 comes with the "D501" engine. This particular Hemi I found is a "KD500", which the "Catalog" does not even mention. According to numerous Hemi serial # sources on the web, they all agree that the "KDS" engines are "polys"(not true hemis) while the "KD500" is a 325 "hemi" and the "D501" is a 354 "hemi". The KDS and KD500 are DODGE engines while the D501 (354) is a CHRYSLER. As for the lifter situation, I don't know. A friend who lives near the car looked at it and got the serial# for me. The lifters may be the key to this whole thing, so I'll try to get him back out there to check it out again. The real issue is that a true D500 comes with a stiffer suspension and other hidden goodies. A regular Royal with a Hemi just wouldn't be the same. Thanks a lot for the info, Ted ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 3 Apr 1999 16:31:56 -0700 From: Marc Piccioni Subject: RE: Camshafts Robert, Did you glean this information directly from Vizard or via 1 of his excellent books? /Marc - ---------- From: Robert Harris[SMTP:bob@xxx.com] Sent: April 3, 1999 6:51 AM To: diy_efi@xxx.edu Subject: RE: Camshafts My point perzactly Bruce. I've ran across his input many times from do'ers. Latest was when I was talking to the man who put dual plugs in his 460 heads who had a number of conversations with him about it. I agree with you about rag riters and have not met many of them that do anything other than spout advertising. If you start from a known accurate baseline such as obtained from a reputable cam builder or author, and you know how it works, then you can do things that ain't posed to work cause you found the twist. Ignorance of how things work is bliss only to a salesman. I personally put Rhodes Lifters on a Kettering 429 and noticed an immediate improvement in milage and low end drivablity - so I KNOW they work. From Vizard I found out how and why. A Vizardian twist. Excess overlap and to a lessor extend late intake closing are primarily responsible for loss of low end power on using a long duration cam. If you put Rhodes ( other ) lifters on the EXHAUST only, you can regain about 75% of that loss. Why - understanding that the reduction in duration comes primarily at closing - means that using a leak down lifter on the exhaust only - trims a bunch of overlap at low rpm. A nice advantageous change is made in both the lobe center and timing as the lifters closing duration is increased with increasing rpm. Another Vizardian note. Unless you markedly improve the oiling system - you will never gain the full lift and duration of the leak down lifter. Huh?? Aeration. If there is any air in the oil, the lifter won't fully pump up. Remember these little suckers use a lot more oil than stock lifters to work. So if you don't clean up the aeration in a stock system by at least a windage tray and scraper, you don't get the full advantage of the lifter. So maybe there might be some good in talking to a reputable cam builder as Dr Bruce suggests or RTFBing prior to buying into something. Just a thought. 1963 Ford C-600 Prison Bus Conversion "Home" 1971 Lincoln Continental 460 "Christine" 1972 "Whale" Mustang awaiting transplant 1978 Dodge Long Bed Peeek Up "Bundymobile" Habaneros - not just for breakfast anymore begin 600 WINMAIL.DAT M>)\^(@`7`0:0" `$```````!``$``0>0!@`(````Y 0```````#H``$-@ 0` M`@````(``@`!!) &`% !```!````# ````,``# #````"P`/#@`````"`?\/ M`0```%L`````````@2L?I+ZC$!F=;@#=`0]4`@````!D:7E?969I0&5S;"YE M;F5]E9FE 97-L+F5N9RYO:&EO+7-T871E+F5D=2<` M`````@$+, $````D````4TU44#I$25E?149)0$533"Y%3D`' ``0````X```!213H@0V%M M# $````%````4TU44 `````>`!\,`0```!@```!M<&EC8VEO;FE 871T M8V%N861A+FYE= `#``80+!UR<@,`!Q"(!P``'@`($ $```!E````4D]"15)4 M+$1)1%E/54=,14%.5$A)4TE.1D]234%424].1$E214-43%E&4D]-5DE:05)$ M3U)624$Q3T9(25-%6$-%3$Q%3E1"3T]+4S\O34%20RTM+2TM+2TM+2U&4D]- M.E)/0@`````"`0D0`0```,\'``#+!P``+ T``$Q:1G6]]+!I_P`*`0\"%0*H M!>L"@xxx.W M`N0'$P*#-!+,%,@xxx.QI_,C4U`H *@0VQP0M@ M;F2$(8"!G;&4#D71H M+00`( N `A!R`,!T:1$"("!D:1J 8W1LA'D@`U(@5FEZ"Q$J( 6Q=@- WP#- I`PM9,1@xxx.BPN*J8, M@AD?52!("L %$'-;4Y!-5% Z!N!B0#$1(R&0!9%M<'43T')GZ'5Y+C&Q72O/ M+-T&8#<","X/+QM!$U #$3,LA210.3=P(#8Z-1] S$%-,K\LW51O-/\O&\DB MH'E?#\E`6S" M4C$+8'!6DVU#;;%_;U %P"3P$]!UDEZ21J%A^FM(0&,:$%MR6I8:@$9P_P40 M`, V\2,0&H!:00"!84%_:/$%P("A7\$DD'7&1H!W_U&B`Z!H@$TR?M$"($U0 M/A"_7H$B86%X1]-%535&SC-T!E5AJ 9\<+ M<5J64X,W-257]%BA^X-21]%7>N!VX6DA2N$!D/]6L$TS6))-HAJ!1Z B4T]1 M_X6^`W 'D8&X6*& E7;A!X#_!B)8@X3G(5!H0$JP7A&(U/^)10J%)/ 1@&B M!4!L\W;P_G2!P5:!8A%JD%,0)(%]Y_.,\@?@K)ZQ4']RWX0# SGF4TR1J%- M@xxx.2^UDS1]%*EC(D0&+Q3Q##,'-;O3=@-C,ML 6P(-!#MBU$P$_@4#"!(G%" M:("G0K!2%")B(DB1(2+,9_XW'T!P@&J0!O #H,Z!(E"/7S" ,0,@3\(B0V@P M@;?1`L^)$> BC8!MH2(%T/^6,1UQ2)!,`%+P33-(85I =QUA57;0`3@@H 1P M=5%,585R0F!!4 G@xxx.0%:P!L ?< ,0SW=_"H4P4%[07S!(P7;A M5S)JRY8R@Q)BH,%K9KOC2=#OM3)#7T1N%6(R$K JI@J%!1FA`-^P``,`$! ` M`````P`1$ ````! ```#T``0````4` ,``!213H@`````/Q! ` end ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 03 Apr 1999 18:57:31 -0500 From: Shannen Durphey Subject: Re: 73 Chevy v8 question Stowe, Ted-SEA wrote: > > Thanks very much to everyone for helping me id my Chevy 350. > > I believe it to be a '73 350 out of a passenger car, which one I can't tell, > I am assuming a 2 bolt main. whether it was rebuilt or not I can't tell. > > the head casting # is 3973487 > the carb id, (2bl Rochester ) is 7043114 > the block id is 3970010 > the intake is 3997773 > > the distributor I can't find listed anywhere, it is a 1111440 8c19, the > 8c19 would normally tell me that the distributor was built on march 19th > 1978, but how that got there I can't tell. It is a single point dist. > If you have room, consider an HEI swap. So good, you'll never want to leave home without it. > I cannot get the waterpump nor the exhaust manifold numbers. > > a great numbers book is 'Chevrolet by the numbers' really nice for this sort > of thing. Do you have this book? Can you look up the cylinder head number I posted a couple of days ago? > > I have a question about the intake manifold, this is not a efi question, I > wish it was but I am trying to do the right thing here. Putting an efi > system on my mgb has taught me to pay lots attention to details and think > before doing anything. > Good for you. You learned after the first try. ; ) > I took the carb off and sent it out to be rebuilt, as it idled funny +,- > 300+ rpm, and I took the intake manifold off and had it tanked because it > was just too dirty. > > I did this also because the egr valve appeared not to work, and after seeing > the egr valve passages from the outside all clogged, I just thought that was > the problem. > Better find some manuals. EGR doesn't apply at idle. If the EGR passage is plugged, it won't affect idle speed. > now with a clean manifold I think I see something else. this 'egr' manifold, > has two small ports on the passenger side, that would appear to mate with 2 > ports on the head on that side. these ports are right under the egr valve on > that side. > Should be 1 rectangular hole in the center of each head, slightly smaller then the pair of holes on either side. This feeds exhaust to the EGR. I know which "ports" you're seeing. They have no mates in any engine I've seen. > however there are no ports on either head for such a purpose, and no holes > in the old intake manifold gaskets either. so even with the intake's egr > ports cleaned up, nothing is going to happen. > Not true. Blow air through the holes under the EGR valve and see where it comes out. Block off your "mystery" ports when you do. > so is this a clear case of a different set of heads/manifold ? or is this > not a problem ? > does anyone sell an egr valve block off plate ? I'd hate to kind of leave > this condition existing as the egr passages are just going to load up with > carbon again. You'll probably have a better answer for this after you try the above test. > > also, in looking at the HP ratings for 350's around that time, (73), what > happened to the HP ratings ? this engine would appear to have a hp rating of > 145. the 350's prior seemed to have about 25+ more, was this a different > method of measuring hp ? or was this the result of the emission requirements > at the time ?? HP measurements went from Gross to SAE Net. Same engine suddenly rated "as installed" and appeared to lose power. > > I accidentally got a set of felpro intake manifold gaskets that appear to be > for a intake manifold that blocks off the exhaust crossover. I would guess > that this was done to help cold running conditions, any advice on retaining > this or not ? Depends on your local climate. Cold weather driveability is often hampered by blocking exhaust crossover. Some manifolds rely on the hot crossover to open the choke. > > thanks for all you're help. when finances and time permits I would just love > to efi this. > this is a 350 in a 72 xj6 with a turbo 350, I plan to put a 4 speed auto in > it sometime. You've got some learning ahead of you, by the sounds of things. You might want to bite the bullet and find a used v-8 TBI setup, so you could be learning about a more current fuel system. They're not even teaching carbies in the trade schools anymore. Also, you really should get a good reference manual for the carb if you're going to stick with it. You can spend lots of time "mucking about" and never solve any problems. I like "Rochester Carburetors", by Doug Roe. Good luck! Shannen > > Ted Stowe ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 03 Apr 1999 19:07:02 -0500 From: Shannen Durphey Subject: Re: ABS Wheel sensor signal generator Chris Moore wrote: > > Hi Shannen, > I have the GM manuals for the 1995 Seville. It is very nice. It > still does not have the info that I need in it. The wheel sensor is > different than most. It is internal in the wheel bearing and I cannot > count the teeth. How else can I get this signal? Dealers probably > won't have a clue. They usually never do. Careful, I'm a dealership tech. > Especially when I tell them what I am doing. >Is there some how I can use the bearing and just spin > it by hand to get a signal and do some math to make sure I can make a > generator that is set over the 18 mile/hour mark? > Thanks > If you can find a failed bearing and a press, try to take it apart. More work would be to measure the signal output frequency at a known speed. This would require a running car, a suitable DVOM, and a sturdy set of jackstands. Then there's trial and error with an adjustable frequency signal generator... Shannen > Chris Moore > > >From: Shannen Durphey > >Reply-To: diy_efi@xxx.edu > >To: diy_efi@xxx.edu > >Subject: Re: ABS Wheel sensor signal generator > >Date: Sat, 03 Apr 1999 05:41:24 -0500 > > > >This is legwork information. There's a very good chance that the > >exact answer won't be found on this list. > >You can: > >try searching the archives > >spend time at a Cadillac dealer asking questions and looking in a > >service manual (and being very polite) > >order a service manual through the dealer > >see if there's good training manuals available for that system: > >address is below > > > >Easiest way is to look at axle at parts store to count # of sensor > >teeth, and get diameter of correct size tire for car, then do math. > >Lots of folks on this list willing to help, but buried in projects of > >their own. > > > >factory training manuals: > >MSX International > >1425 Pacific Dr. > >Auburn Hills, MI 48326 > >Phone (800) 393-4831 > >Fax (248)377-1510 > > > >Shannen > >Chris Moore wrote: > >> > >> Hi Everyone, > >> I want to say thanks for all the people who have answered some of > my > >> questions. It looks like I now need some kind of signal generator to > >> produce the same signal an ABS sensor would produce. It looks like I > >> need the signal to be made for 18 miles/hour or more. How can I find > >> this out without actually having a car to check? Can someone give me > an > >> idea or maybe someone already knows. Remember, the Northstar and > trans > >> are from a 1995 Seville STS. Thanks. > >> > >> Chris Moore > >> Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com > > > > Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 3 Apr 1999 19:56:30 EST From: JRECPA@xxx.com Subject: Re: '50s MOPAR Hemi question In a message dated 4/3/99 4:40:24 PM US Mountain Standard Time, Tedscj@xxx.com writes: << In a message dated 4/3/99 4:58:49 PM Eastern Standard Time, clare.snyder.on.ca@xxx.net writes: > Does your 325 have solid or hydraulic lifters? The hydraulic lifter > engine was standard on the Royal Custom - solids made it a D500 .Super > D500 had dual quads and solids. > The D501 was the 354 cid engine with hydraulics and dual 4BBls. > All were Hemis. > > If this is a DODGE engine, not Chrysler od Desoto, you can be sure this > is correct. I think I have the same source of information as James (Standard Catalog of American Autos). It basically says that Coronet, Royal and Custom Royals come with a "KDS" engine and the D500 comes with the "D501" engine. This particular Hemi I found is a "KD500", which the "Catalog" does not even mention. According to numerous Hemi serial # sources on the web, they all agree that the "KDS" engines are "polys"(not true hemis) while the "KD500" is a 325 "hemi" and the "D501" is a 354 "hemi". The KDS and KD500 are DODGE engines while the D501 (354) is a CHRYSLER. As for the lifter situation, I don't know. A friend who lives near the car looked at it and got the serial# for me. The lifters may be the key to this whole thing, so I'll try to get him back out there to check it out again. The real issue is that a true D500 comes with a stiffer suspension and other hidden goodies. A regular Royal with a Hemi just wouldn't be the same. Thanks a lot for the info, Ted >> According to my chiltons book the 325's were all hydraulic lifters. The D500 had the hemi head. My question to you is this the best choice for an engine? The old hemi's weight was a problem for acceleration. If it was me that wanted an older hemi I would get the 392 from a 57 c-300. Rated at 375HP with solid lifters. James ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 03 Apr 1999 20:22:12 -0500 From: Hugo Villeneuve Subject: Re: Injector driver question... > I guess that the frequency should be half that. > 5000/60 = 83.33 rps / 2 (4stroke) = 41.67 Hz. > Or Am I wrong ? > >Ricardo Seixas > 41.67 Hz if your are injecting once per two crankshaft revolution (sequential injection), or 83.33 Hz if you are injecting once per crankshaft revolution (simultaneaous injection) like I do. Hugo. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 03 Apr 1999 20:43:45 -0500 From: Jason Weir Subject: 7-Pin HEI Module Does anyone know of an application where a 7-pin HEI module fits inside a big cap distributor. I want to switch from an external to an internal coil setup, but the distributor I got only came with the 4-pin module.. Thanks, Jason Weir - -- 88 Wrangler - 155K miles and counting 258 I6, 4.0 head, Cherokee header, 2 1/2 exhaust with high flow cat & Flowmaster GM TBI, Crane 260H Cam TJ Fender Flares http://home.att.net/~jweir CNC 4X4 Member - http://cnc.4x4.org/ ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 3 Apr 1999 18:57:55 -0700 From: cwagner@xxx.net Subject: 1227148 Thank you for clearing things up. If any body would like a 7148 computer, just let me know at cwagner@xxx. I would like to trade it for a memcal out of a 7730 that was made for a 350 or a 7747 computer. I also have a couple of memcal's out of what I believe to be a 1226864 or something similar. They don't have any knock sensor controlers in them if that is a problem. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 3 Apr 1999 21:35:33 EST From: Tedscj@xxx.com Subject: Re: '50s MOPAR Hemi question In a message dated 4/3/99 8:01:17 PM Eastern Standard Time, JRECPA@xxx.com writes: > According to my chiltons book the 325's were all hydraulic lifters. > The D500 had the hemi head. > > My question to you is this the best choice for an engine? > The old hemi's weight was a problem for acceleration. > If it was me that wanted an older hemi I would get the 392 from a > 57 c-300. Rated at 375HP with solid lifters. > > James I don't want just the engine, I want the whole car to restore. And it would be more worthwhile to restore a rare "high performance" car (for the class and period) than just any 'ol Dodge. The guy originally represented it as a D500 with a 354 hemi. After referencing the serial# I now know he was wrong about the engine (325 hemi) and maybe wrong about the whole car. I don't think he was deliberately dishonest, but maybe just "assuming" too much. I don't want to make the same mistake. Especially if I have to lay out a couple grand. It's also kinda difficult since I can't see the car myself (400 miles away). My friend knows about cars in general and can judge condition for me but I need to see it to make a judgment about authenticity. Ted ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 3 Apr 1999 18:50:34 -0800 (PST) From: Jim Davies Subject: Re: '50s MOPAR Hemi question On Sat, 3 Apr 1999 JRECPA@xxx.com wrote: > >> > According to my chiltons book the 325's were all hydraulic lifters. > The D500 had the hemi head. > > My question to you is this the best choice for an engine? > The old hemi's weight was a problem for acceleration. > If it was me that wanted an older hemi I would get the 392 from a > 57 c-300. Rated at 375HP with solid lifters. > The 1950s era mopar V8s are a very complex situation. The best way I found to figure them out was to go by rod and main bearing sizes. The best source, a tuners tip in the old mopar yellow book even used the same system. They also admitted that no one knows what was done with complete accuracy. IIRC, the 1957 D500 actually listed a 354 Chrysler engine, while earlier D500s used dodge hemis. Ther are single rocker and double rocker [hemi] versions of most of the V8s of this era, including the 354 Chrysler. The best of the hemis was a high block desoto based on weight per cubic inch. All of them were pretty good power producers. Oh yeah, most have a low block and raised block version, which used different rod or main [or both] bearing, just to add a bit of interest... Expect EVERY sighting report to be wrong. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 3 Apr 1999 22:01:34 -0500 From: "Bruce Plecan" Subject: Re: 1227148 - ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Saturday, April 03, 1999 8:57 PM Subject: 1227148 The GN Ttype list has a classified section, and you probably could sell it easily over there (it was used in 86-87 Turbos). I don't happen to have the Address Bruce > Thank you for clearing things up. If any body would like a 7148 > computer, just let me know at cwagner@xxx. I would like > to trade it for a memcal out of a 7730 that was made for a 350 or a > 7747 computer. I also have a couple of memcal's out of what I > believe to be a 1226864 or something similar. They don't have any > knock sensor controlers in them if that is a problem. > ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 3 Apr 1999 21:52:39 -0700 From: Marc Piccioni Subject: 7730 ECM Is there a ".ecu" definition file available for the 7730 256K eproms so that I could use "Promedit" ? Also if any one has any information on the sw offsets for the various tables for the AUJP prom I'd be grateful for the information. /Marc ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 3 Apr 1999 21:10:20 -0800 From: "Stowe, Ted-SEA" Subject: RE: identifying a Chevy 350 block and Trans Shannon, I can't find this number in any of my books either, nor can I find any '370 heads. I will run this through an internet web search too and let you know. Ted Stowe - -----Original Message----- From: David [mailto:David_f_edwards@xxx.com] Sent: Monday, March 29, 1999 11:53 AM To: diy_efi@xxx.edu Subject: Re: identifying a Chevy 350 block and Trans Shannon, I did not find this number in my book. Did you take it from between the valves under the valve cover? David - -----Original Message----- From: Shannen Durphey To: diy_efi@xxx.edu> Date: Friday, March 26, 1999 6:40 PM Subject: Re: identifying a Chevy 350 block and Trans |Forgive me for butting in. I have a mystery s.b. chevy head I need |identified. If you or anyone else can help, the casting # appears to |be 8973370. TIA |Shannen | |David wrote: |> |> Ted, |> |> If you can give me the casting numbers on the block, heads, intake, etc., I |> can look them up and tell you more about the engine. |> |> David Edwards |> |> -----Original Message----- |> From: Stowe, Ted-SEA |> To: 'diy_efi@xxx.edu> |> Date: Friday, March 26, 1999 11:38 AM |> Subject: identifying a Chevy 350 block and Trans |> |> |hi. I just bought a jag with a Chevy 350 engine and Chevy trans. |> | |> |it is a constrained motor with what looks like a single barrel Rochester |> and |> |those rams horn exhaust manifolds. but I believe the manifolds need to stay |> |there to fit in the engine compartment. The engine might have some height |> |restrictions maybe that's why that carb is there. |> | |> | |> |I would like to identify the engine for tune up purposes. Also the egr |> valve |> |is disconnected, and there are the usual 2-3 plugged up vacuum ports on the |> |carb and manifold. I believe that having a working egr valve is a good |> |thing, exactly where was that attached ? |> | |> |thanks, Ted Stowe |> | | | ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 4 Apr 1999 00:41:57 EST From: ECMnut@xxx.com Subject: Re: Toyota Supra twin turbo and water injection. In a message dated 4/3/99 7:07:46 AM Eastern Standard Time, edwards@xxx.net writes: << I have been searching for place I Japan where I can buy some engines Can > you direct me to the right place? No I do not want a 20 foot container full > of engines. Don't know where to get them in Japan... But, midwest-engine.com buys them by the 20 foot container, and imports them to the states. They are in Ohio, and ship all over the USA. Mike V ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 3 Apr 1999 21:51:17 -0800 (PST) From: andy quaas Subject: Re: 7-Pin HEI Module Around 1984 or so they started using the electronic advanced HEI (big-cap style, internal coil). They used them on zillions of 305/350s with an "electronic" Q-Jet. I don't know the differences between the internals of the 6 cylinder HEIs, but the actual housing and shaft seem to be the same between the vacuum and the electronic big-cap HEIs, so maybe the 6's are the same? Andy p.s. why do u want to switch? - --- Jason Weir wrote: > Does anyone know of an application where a 7-pin HEI > module fits inside > a big cap distributor. I want to switch from an > external to an internal > coil setup, but the distributor I got only came with > the 4-pin module.. > > Thanks, > Jason Weir > -- > 88 Wrangler - 155K miles and counting > 258 I6, 4.0 head, Cherokee header, 2 1/2 exhaust > with high flow cat & > Flowmaster > GM TBI, Crane 260H Cam > TJ Fender Flares > http://home.att.net/~jweir > CNC 4X4 Member - http://cnc.4x4.org/ > _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @xxx.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 04 Apr 1999 00:07:06 -0600 From: DC Smith Subject: Re: 1227148 Hey guys. Just go to http://www.gnttype.org/ A link to the Turbo TRader is towards the bottom of the index. I sell a lot of tested/guaranteed 7148 ECM's to the TR group for 50 FRN's + 7.00 frt/insurance. (US Priority mail) I prefer to run em at he track during testing, and put the ET/MPH on em for grins. That way I can link my laptop to it and see how things look. (I hate draggin all that stuff out all the time at home..) I know if I can run my car low 12's on em, they are gonna be ok. I only have five 7148's here right now.. been trying to save em up for the nats, so I haven't posted a add lately.:) Go put a add in to sell it. Is it a good puter? take care. Dan Bruce Plecan wrote: > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: > To: > Sent: Saturday, April 03, 1999 8:57 PM > Subject: 1227148 > > The GN Ttype list has a classified section, and you probably could sell it > easily > over there (it was used in 86-87 Turbos). I don't happen to have the > Address > Bruce > > > Thank you for clearing things up. If any body would like a 7148 > > computer, just let me know at cwagner@xxx. I would like > > to trade it for a memcal out of a 7730 that was made for a 350 or a > > 7747 computer. I also have a couple of memcal's out of what I > > believe to be a 1226864 or something similar. They don't have any > > knock sensor controlers in them if that is a problem. > > - -- *********************************************************************** Dan Smith 84 Regal 12.13@112 GSCA# 1459 St.Charles, Missouri mailto:dcsmith@xxx.net http://www.tetranet.net/users/morepoweral *********************************************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 3 Apr 1999 23:13:36 -0700 (MST) From: Daniel Houlton Subject: ERL water pump I got my ERL Aquamist pump earlier this week. Turns out it's the newer 'Race' model that puts out a much higher pressure and volume than the standard pump. I did some bench testing and figured I'd post the results in case any one's interested. I powered the pump from my truck battery with jumper cables. I also did the tests with the truck running. It was substantially lower (~25%) without it running. I ran all the tests for 1 minute into a measuring cup in ml. I converted them to gph by multiplying by .0158503 ( I got this number from one of those super duper shareware convert damn-near-anything utilities for Win95). The pump came with one ERL .7mm nozzle. They have a wide range from .1mm to 1mm in .1mm increments. I also got some "mister nozzles" from McMaster Carr. These are a full cone style. I'm not sure of the orafice size. Just the flow rates they published for them. They are M-1 --> .63 gph @ 40 psi M-2 --> 1.26 gph @ 40 psi M-3 --> 1.9 gph @ 40 psi These were their 3 smallest ones. They ran all the way up to around 9 gph I think. McMaster also has the "Instant Connect" hose connectors. These are the nice ones that you just push the hose in and it locks. To unlock, you hold the little ring back (in the opposite direction) and pull the hose out. These are the same type ERL uses. Very nice and work like a charm. All the nozzles produce an extremely fine mist of water. The M-1 was the best I assume because of the much higher pressure. They all looked more like a fog almost than a fan of water. Here's the chart of the results. I also ran tests of 2 nozzles in parallel using a tee connector. - --------------------------------------------------- |gal/hr | | M-1 | M-2 | M-3 | .7mm |-------|------------------------------------------ | | | 1.59 | 2.46 | 3.17 | 3.57 | |------------------------------------------ | M-1 | 1.59 | 3.01 3.49 3.96 | M-2 | 2.46 | 3.49 4.20 4.68 | M-3 | 3.17 | 3.96 4.68 4.99 | .7mm | 3.57 | - --------------------------------------------------- I also measured static pressure on one end of the tee with each of the single nozzles on the other. It only went up to 200 psi so I'm not sure of the pressure for the M-1. M-1 >>> 200 psi M-2 170 psi M-3 140 psi .7mm 115 psi Also, the pump has 3 wires. Power, ground and what the documentation says is a 0 - 12v signal wire. Grounding the signal wire turns the pump off. At about 1.5v, the pump comes on. Varying the voltage on the signal wire didn't change the pump output any. It was still on or off. I'm thinking now the MF2 controller they sell for it must send a variable frequency to control the pump output rather than a variable voltage as I had thought (hoped). They supplied a pressure switch to turn the pump on when not using the MF2. It is a Normally Closed type that goes in the signal wire which is hooked to ground. At 10 psi (adjustable), the switch opens, the signal is no longer grounded and the pump comes on. I've got it in an Excel sheet with more detail, part numbers, etc. if anyone's interested. It will be a couple days, but I can send it out to whoever wants it. - --Dan houlster@xxx.com http://www.inficad.com/~houlster/amigo.htm ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 03 Apr 1999 22:15:38 -0800 From: Eric Schumacher Subject: Re: ABS Wheel sensor signal generator Hi Folks This post is directed to Chris Moore specifically but may be usefull to others, particularly those looking for waveforms. On Compuserve, on the "Automobile Forum" there is a section "For Techs Only" . This section has an archive on which there are a vast variety of waveforms having to do with automoblies posted, probally thousands. Good, bad and analyzed. Most have to do with engine managment but a few have to do with chassis electronics. Commoners used to be able to post to the forum but they stopped that about a year ago. I have had good luck however e-mailing directly to many of the posters on the forum. This is a tremendous resource for those interested in EFI there are many very knowledgable techs lurking there. Not to put anyone down but the quality information contained in posts, and the archives, automotive electronics wise, is considerable higher than the DIY-EFI list. I mention this only to indicate the high quality of the resource. Few of these people are designing stuff but they are generally very knowledgable and experienced in the ins and outs of automotive electronics. Lotsa Luck Eric 85 GTI with VR6 power ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 3 Apr 1999 23:35:41 -0700 (MST) From: Daniel Houlton Subject: Water injectin: How much? Or maybe propane? Regarding my new ERL water pump in my previous message, I have some questions on how much water to inject. First, I'm running an Isuzu 2.6l 4 cylinder that I turbocharged using junkyard parts (rebuilt the turbo though). Max boost is 9 psi. Compression is 8.6:1. On regular gas, I get detonation at about 5 - 6 psi. On 92 octane, it holds off to 8 - 9 psi and even then not all the time. It depends on how hot out it is and how long I've been driving (open K&N in the engine bay. Not good I know. I'm working on it). I am not yet running an intercooler either. Max HP according to HomeDyno is 140 at the wheels, up from 94 before the turbo. The before turbo run was calibrated against a chassis dyno run so I know the HomeDyno results are accurate. This is a bit below the 150 or so mathematical HP I should get with 9 psi, but I assume this is because of the large heat buildup. Any idea how much water I should be injecting? I was hoping to modulate the pump by using a MAP sensor and sending increasing voltage to the signal wire as boost goes up. I'm now thinking that I can use a tee to two nozzles. Plumb one side of the tee through a solenoid. Have the pump come on at say 4 psi, injecting through one nozzle. At say 6 or 7 psi, open the solenoid so it's injecting through 2 nozzles. This is just an idea to conserve water and still get injection in the lower boost areas. I'd like to be able to run regular 87 or 88 octane gas again. I'll need to start injecting by at least 4 psi I think. I typically only hit about 5 or 6 psi unless I'm really on it so if I can hold off injecting the full amount of water until then it means I won't have to refill nearly as often (in theory anyways). Any flaws in this or should I just dump all I can as soon as I can. It's only water after all. I'm planning a second tank underneath some where anyways so I should be able to get 2 or 3 gallons total storage. The idea is the upper (winshield washer) tank will feed the pump. When it's low water level switch closes it'll power the pump in the lower tank to re-plentish the upper. The low level sensor in the lower tank I'll wire to a light in the cab somewhere. The other question is about injecing liquid propane through the nozzles instead of water. The pump is sealed so the liquid is seperated from the pump mechanism. I haven't asked ERL yet about propane, but they do say it's safe for ethenol, methenol, etc. The propane would increase octane and decrease temps as well. Also, if I'm injecting only under boost (this is theory now) the temps should be high enough and the duration low enough that I don't have to worry about nozzles freezing up. The final thing is that I have a shortage of fuel at high boost. I haven't yet switched to larger injectors, run an additional injector or anything else to increase fuel. I'm wondering if I could tweak it enough that the propane in addition to doing what the water would do would work as the extra fuel I'd need. I know there are more issues with makeing it play nicely with the ECM and getting the A/F ratio correct, but I'm just wondering if it's technically possible or is it hair-brained? I'd probably at least figure out how to control the pump (or break down and get the MF2 controller ERL sells) so that I could have a nearly infinite injection range rather than a 1 or 2 step on/off kind of switch. thanks - --Dan houlster@xxx.com http://www.inficad.com/~houlster/amigo.htm ------------------------------ End of DIY_EFI Digest V4 #208 ***************************** To subscribe to DIY_EFI-Digest, send the command: subscribe diy_efi-digest in the body of a message to "Majordomo@xxx. A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to subscribe to that instead, replace "diy_efi-digest" in the command above with "diy_efi".