DIY_EFI Digest         Monday, April 12 1999         Volume 04 : Number 222



In this issue:

	RE: Circuit boards
	Another Question about the Northstar
	RE: Halp Diamond Star Motoring
	Re: Briggs and Stratton
	Re: Mitsubishi MUT-II test connector
	Re: Conversion suggestions...
	Re: Circuit boards
	Re: Conversion suggestions...
	Re: EEC-IV Modifying
	Re: EEC-IV Modifying for low impedance injectors
	Re: EEC-IV Modifying for low impedance injectors
	Re: EEC-IV Modifying for low impedance injectors

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----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Sun, 11 Apr 1999 21:07:45 -0600
From: Marc Piccioni <mpiccioni@xxx.net>
Subject: RE: Circuit boards

Tom

Usually mass production PCB assembly techniques, under each part is a drop 
of "crazy glue" like adhesive to hold the bit in place during wavesoldeing. 
If you have a PCB that you don't care about try acetone to dissolve the 
potting compound. Usually after the pins are desoldered, a careful 
application of force will crack the adhesive loose.

/Marc

- ----------
From: 	Tom Sharpe[SMTP:twsharpe@xxx.com]
Sent: 	April 11, 1999 1:54 PM
To: 	efi332@xxx.edu
Subject: 	Circuit boards

I have a couple of EEC_IV boards that I am trying to disassemble. The
CPU and ROM  seem to be glued down then sodered into place. There is
also a heavy, clear coating (waterproofing?) over everything.

Does anyone know what will disolve this without destroying the board?

How about the glue?

Thanks in Advance   Tom Sharpe






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------------------------------

Date: Sun, 11 Apr 1999 20:22:15 PDT
From: "Chris Moore" <northstar87@xxx.com>
Subject: Another Question about the Northstar

Hi everyone,
  I think you all know the problem I was having.  But for those who 
don't, My wheels will not peel out.  I have a power problem in the 
low end.  Again I think it has to do with the Torque Management 
system on the 4.6 Northstar.  I was looking into just making a pulse 
generator to produce a wheel speed signal and run it into the brake 
module.  But I was thinking.  The Northstar has two wires that run 
into the PCM from the EBTCM(Electronic Brake Traction Control Module)
that have to do with the controling of the Torque Management.  The 
first wire is Delivered Torque and the second wire is Desired Torque 
Output.  These are the wires that let the PCM know how many injectors 
to shut down and how much timing to retard.  It is read by a scanner 
by percentage.0% to 100%.  Now, common sense tells me that one of the 
wires are a power wire and one is a ground or a return.  Is there any 
way that I could run the correct voltage to the PCM that will say 
that there is 0% of Torque Management and that would do away with the 
EBTCM all together.  With that being done, that would save me all the 
hassles of trying to fool the EBTCM.  There are other variables to 
that we would have to try to fool like the RPM, VSS, Throttle 
position.  If we could just figure out how much voltage to send than 
we could just get rid of the EBTCM and all the other variables would 
not matter.  I hope someone can help me.  Thanks everyone for the 
help.

Chris Moore 

_______________________________________________________________
Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 12 Apr 1999 14:17:15 +1000
From: George Gorman <george_gorman@xxx.au>
Subject: RE: Halp Diamond Star Motoring

Broken OH cams in alloy heads can result from a bad overheating experience
- - the head permanently warps and can put enough force on the cam bearings
to crack the cams.

This advice came courtesy of a backyarder experienced with 2 ltr mazda
626/ford telstar alloy heads.

George Gorman


At 09:08 9/04/99 -0700, you wrote:
>
>Peter,
>
>Unfortunately, it is an interference engine.  The timing belts have a habit
>of breaking and taking a few (or many) valves along for the ride.  Those in
>the know recommend changing the timing and balance belts every 30,000 miles.
>I've never heard of anyone breaking a cam though, so maybe you've got
>something else going on.
>
>After markets cams are not real popular, but they do exist so you can
>probably pick up a used cam on the parts trader.  Though, once you start
>pulling parts you're likely to find out that it's not worth fixing.  
>
>Good Luck,
>Mike
>
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Peter Fenske [mailto:pfenske@xxx.ca]
>Sent: Friday, April 09, 1999 1:48 AM
>To: diy_efi@xxx.edu
>Subject: RE: Halp Diamond Star Motoring
>
>
>
>
>Hi All
>
>Thanks to David, Bruce and Mike as well as others for help with
>the 2.0 mitsibushi..
>
>Prob was a broken exhaust cam.. Cam sensor is driven off intake cam
>broken halfway to be exact..
>
>Well hope is not an interference engine..

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 11 Apr 1999 23:29:10 +0000
From: xxalexx@xxx.com
Subject: Re: Briggs and Stratton

Possible that new B&S or using fuel inj. to meet emission stds.
Some Honda engines?
Also check your local drag strip and kart track.
alex
> I am looking to replace a regular 
carbueration system on a briggs and
> stratton 5 HP engine with a single port fuel injection system.  I was
> wondering if anybody had any suggestions for feedback control, LED display
> of RPM's, or the amplifier needed from the spark.  Please respond ASAP!!
> 

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 11 Apr 1999 23:29:09 +0000
From: xxalexx@xxx.com
Subject: Re: Mitsubishi MUT-II test connector

> Does anyone know anything about Mitsubishi MUT-II test connector ? Vehicle
> what I am talking about is new 99 Pajero 2800 turbo diesel.
> 
> Connector looks like standard OBD-II connector but having little notch at
> pin # 1 end.  I have not yet measured anything from the connector but in the
> future I will do this.
> Pins populated at the connector and descriptions according OBD-II standard:
> 1 = ?
> 4 = chassis ground
> 5 = signal ground
> 7 = ISO K-line  ?
> 8 = ?
> 12 = ?
> 13 = ?
> 14 = CAN low ?
> 16 = batt +
> 
Pin 2, 7, 10 , 15  or  OBD2 pins so very  possible you have a ISO-K
for diagnostics, which most Asian cars do.  There is  clauses
in  J1962-5 that state you can use these pins for other things.
Ford uses 2 and 10 for PWM but also has pin 7 for some other use.
I have SAE J1962  1994   connector specs in  SAE HS-3000  1995 
which does not show any CAN or KWP2000.  I am not sure
if these have been fully approved as a J1850 alternative 
http://www.od2ii.com has a connector diagram showing CAN pins.
Pin 7 is at Bat. voltage logic 0 
It will be a while before I get SAE-3000 1998
You could also check ISO 14299 and 14230
alex
http://www.obd-2.com    

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 12 Apr 1999 00:31:59 -0400
From: Shannen Durphey <shannen@xxx.com>
Subject: Re: Conversion suggestions...

You're not going to like this.  That combination doesn't exist. ; ) 
The only vehicle I show with that engine in that year is the step van
chassis (P2, P3), and it's got a 1 bbl carb.  I looked at 88 and found
a 4.8 R,V truck.  It's 1 bbl carb'ed.  I think 1/2 ton vehicles were
subject to CA emissions (more stringent, more likely to have better
fuel system) and larger ones weren't.
Also, there's no TBI 3.8 that I know of.  Seriously, look into the TBI
from the Jeep I6, and GM ECM for control.  I think this is what Jason
Weir did.  He's got some stuff up on the web.
Shannen 

David A. Cooley wrote:
> 
> At 08:08 PM 4/11/99 -0400, you wrote:
> >Sorry, all carb'ed w/ California emissions.  Any time I see a prom or
> >ecm listing for any GM truck that's pre 1986, I suspect carb + CA.
> >But I don't mind looking up cal id's, just in case.
> >Shannen
> 
> Hmm...
> How about the 1989 Chevy R20 pickup with the 4.8L L6?
> ===========================================================
>            David Cooley N5XMT           Internet: N5XMT@xxx.net
>      Packet: N5XMT@xxx. Member #7068
>    Sponges grow in the ocean... Wonder how deep it would be if they didn't?!
> ===========================================================

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 12 Apr 1999 00:08:27 -0500 (CDT)
From: eclark@xxx.com
Subject: Re: Circuit boards

On Sun, 11 Apr 1999, Ken Kelly wrote:

> Tom,
> 	I socketed the flash chips on my 95 Camaro LT1 PCM. It had a clear
> waterproofing all over the board. This seemed to also be under the chips. I

I never saw any of this on my 93 Firebird LT1 ECM, but I did notice it on
the board inside the VATS box when I pulled that out.

- -Eric
 93 Firebird Formula (parting out)
 66 Chevy Impala (soon to have a 93 LT1)

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 11 Apr 1999 23:03:26 -0700
From: "Peter Fenske" <pfenske@xxx.ca>
Subject: Re: Conversion suggestions...

Hi Dave

Closest I can think is to go with the S10 2 bbl TBI setup. Use the stock
2BBl 225 intake with a adapter to mount the 2 bbl TBI. Lots of mopars
had these..

While you are at it find a leaner burn dist, use the main pickup to feed
a 8 pin HEI module tied to the ecm and stock S10 coil..

YOU will have to mount a frame mount fuel pump and the cal
may have to be richened

gL:peter

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 12 Apr 1999 02:33:38 EDT
From: FHPSTANG1@xxx.com
Subject: Re: EEC-IV Modifying

In a message dated 4/11/99 3:25:55 PM Eastern Daylight Time, psd105@xxx.edu 
writes:

<< The whole basis for my project is to do it as cheaply as possible.  Most 
of the
 parts I'm using are stock Ford parts, that were modified by me for this
 project.  The turbos are even off of Ford production cars, purchased for $25 
ea
 in perfect working order!! >>

This sounds like my project. I have a 1979 Mustang, in which I will install a 
stock 5.0L HO motor, and use two T-03 turbos off of Turbo Coupes. I plan on 
running an '89 mustang 5.0 MAF EEC-IV EFI system.

For quite some time now I have been looking at how to add the low imp. 
drivers out of a 2.3L computer, into the 5.0 computer. I have disassembled 
BOTH computers, and the operation looks like it could be very simple. I have 
a few questions, and was also referred to the EEC Mailing list. However, I 
haven't had the chance to ask that list questions, and then wait around for 
the answers. But the EEC mailing list is the place to go!

John Miller
91 FHP Special Service
89/86 'stang & 85 Merkur 2.3L Turbo Hybrid
84 GT350 5.0 T-Top
79 Twin TURBO Project

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 12 Apr 1999 02:52:40 EDT
From: FHPSTANG1@xxx.com
Subject: Re: EEC-IV Modifying for low impedance injectors

In a message dated 4/11/99 4:06:30 PM Eastern Daylight Time, psd105@xxx.edu 
writes:

<< The information I read in the archives from Dan Malek
 stated
 that the Switching Transistors, Zener Diodes, and Heat sinks need to be
 changed.  But, I didn't see any transistors used for the injectors on
 the
 schematic, maybe I'm looking at the wrong schematic?  >>

OK, You need to get your hands on an EEC-IV (2.3L Turbo) And crack that puppy 
open. You can see the injector drivers. HOWEVER, the 2.3L EEC only has 2 
injector drivers. One driver fires 2 injectors. So they are "Batch Fired". 
The 5.0 EEC on the other hand has one driver per injector. But the same 
drivers (Or Switching Transistors) are used to control other things as well, 
(Such as the IAC, EGR etc) and there are a total of 8 drivers (All the same) 
in ONE 2.3L EEC. 

>From what i can see, the computer sends a signal to the driver, which allows 
the current to flow through, a diode and capacitor are involved, and that's 
it. It's a very simple part of the circuit. 

Now where was that EEC-IV Schematic??? I want a copy of that! 

John Miller

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 12 Apr 1999 02:54:32 EDT
From: FHPSTANG1@xxx.com
Subject: Re: EEC-IV Modifying for low impedance injectors

In a message dated 4/11/99 4:22:37 PM Eastern Daylight Time, 
frederic@xxx.com writes:

<< Its nothing more than an inductor in parallel with the ECM output and
 ground, which then feeds a 1k resistor driving a large MOSFET which connects
 to 12V Battery, the low-impedance injector, which in turn connects to
 ground.  This worked very well for non-peak/hold style injectors.  The ECM I
 used was the GM 1418 Grand National ECM (Buick V6 Turbo)
 
 Hope that helped >>

Ummmmmm, could that be put into a schematic, I am having a little difficulty 
picturing this....

John Miller

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 12 Apr 1999 03:01:59 EDT
From: FHPSTANG1@xxx.com
Subject: Re: EEC-IV Modifying for low impedance injectors

In a message dated 4/11/99 4:51:35 PM Eastern Daylight Time, psd105@xxx.edu 
writes:

<< Yup, it did.  Though I really should stop looking at this EEC Schematic I
 found...cause it has Battery Voltage,12v, going through a 390 ohm resistor in
 series  and a .01uF cap in parallel, then into a 5 pin IC, out of the IC to a
 3.6v? 5W diode in parallel, and a 1000pF cap in parallel, then to the 
injector
 then to ground. >>

Oh that helped ME!!!!! I have been trying to find a way to get the values of 
the Diodes and Caps, since these are CHIP Style and soldered directly to the 
board. I Have a nice multi-tester... but it won't give me the values of these 
components.

And another thing, I made my own schematic (Reversed Engineered) of a 2.3L 
EEC driver circuit, and it MAKES NO DAMN SENSE. I understand circuits well 
enough, But this thing is WAY OUT THERE! It looks like the voltage can get to 
the injector, whether or not the Transistor (As I call a driver) is on or 
off! So what's up? It seems to be in parallel, which makes no sense, series 
would... but not parallel. I thought I had just goofed.. But it seems that 
this is how it is!

John Miller

------------------------------

End of DIY_EFI Digest V4 #222
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