DIY_EFI Digest Friday, May 28 1999 Volume 04 : Number 317 In this issue: Re: Prowler V6 Re: alternative engines, now Hemi Re: NC: 2.9X posi IRS pumpking donor/halfshaft q? Re: Getting loans.. (WAY off topic) Re: Prowler V6 RE: Location of intake air temperature sensor More NHRA rules, but not the one were lookin for...Later...Todd... Re: Prowler V6 Re: Prowler V6 Re: Prowler V6 Re: Getting loans.. (WAY off topic) RE: Getting loans.. (WAY off topic) Re: alternative engines, now Hemi Re: Turbo'd s.b. chev...in a 69 Camaro? maybe? Re: Prowler V6 Re: Prowler V6 Re: Turbo'd s.b. chev...in a 69 Camaro? maybe? Re: Prowler V6 Re: NC: 2.9X posi IRS pumpking donor/halfshaft q? Off list Re: Prowler V6 software changes Re: software changes Re: Prowler V6 Re: Getting loans.. (WAY off topic) To Todd Re: NC: 2.9X posi IRS pumpking donor/halfshaft q? Re: Prowler V6 Re: software changes Re: O/T Compression ratio and supercharging, also efi pumps See the end of the digest for information on subscribing to the DIY_EFI or DIY_EFI-Digest mailing lists. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 28 May 1999 15:02:13 -0700 From: "Todd....!!" Subject: Re: Prowler V6 You are correct on the 73 and up mopar motors, some early 73's came with forged cranks n rods, later in 73 they all went to cast...Big and small blocks... Thanks for clarifying WHEN in 73 Mopar went from FORGED to CAST stuff... HOWEVER, up to the end of 72 ALL B/RB Mopars had FORGED cranks n rods, period, this is a well know and documented fact.... LATER, Todd.... http://www.c-com.net/~atc347/toddlnk.htm Bill Edgeworth wrote: > > "Todd....!!" wrote: > > > > > > > So ya see, when ya say 'plain vanilla', back in the 60's and early 70's > > and some MAYBE EVEN NOW, ALL Mopars came with FORGED cranks and rods, > > wheras most others had meager cast units.... > > > > Lots of mopars came with cast cranks, in fact even the last year of the 340 (1973) > it came with a externally balanced cast crank. Cast cranks were very common in the > B-RB engine family. > > Bill Edgeworth ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 May 1999 15:07:12 -0700 From: "Todd....!!" Subject: Re: alternative engines, now Hemi Good points! I WILL find out the diff 'tween a 383/400 and 440 block I have an apart 383 short block at gramps, am about to go up their this weekend, may have to weigh the sucker! How much ya think, just for the block alone? I'll go ahead and weigh the stock crank, rods, n pistons as well... It's good that you modified a B block intake, that means your goin with the 451, ey? GOOD FOR YOU! Go to http://www.c-com.net/~atc347/451/ and view what a dude who's callsign is acutall 451! I cut n pasted some of his info and advice about 451's onto my e-mail website and named it the 451 MANIFESTO! or 451 Domain, can't remember, but it has a lot of specofics on the subject of the 451! MOST GOOD! The main journal size may not be afactor, especially if ya just align bore the mains in the block instead of cut the mains down on the crank! Like Keith black does with most of his high dollar strokers.... LATER! Todd....!! Frederic Breitwieser wrote: > > > There may be more 400's BB Mopes than 440's in certain junkyards... > > It depends on where you live. Up here the roads are predominately > later model FWD vehicles, therefore that's what the yards keep longer > cuz they can sell parts. > > > Which would you prefer? > > I am undecided. The 440 weighs slightly more than the 383/400, but > not enough that the additional cubes would work out just fine. > Though, considering I put 100 hours into modifying my carb intake to > support TPI, fabricated an aluminum plenum, well, might as well stick > with the 383 or 400. So I imagine I just answered my own "undecided". > > Though the 440 has bigger crank journals :) > > -- > > Frederic Breitwieser > Bridgeport CT 06606 > > 1993 Supercharged Lincoln Continental > 1989 HWMMV w/turbocharged 500cid Caddy > 1975 Dodge D200 Club Cab soon to have 431 stroker + turbos > 2000 (I hope) Buick GTP (Mid-Engined Sports Car) ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 May 1999 15:11:13 -0700 From: "Todd....!!" Subject: Re: NC: 2.9X posi IRS pumpking donor/halfshaft q? Hi ya David, The older dude, taht owned the car said that the engine was stock.... the hood was up and the dudes were playin with the spark plugs and the nos solenoids n all were all over the place(Port type Fogger setup) An engine can be BONE stock and still have nitrous on it, just like an engine can be bone stock and still have a turbo on it, guess it depends on how you interpret what someone is saying when they say that their 'motor' is 'stock'... If taken literally, then the motor would be stock if the heads, intake, crank, n rods haven't been changed from factory specs..., like a blue printed engine... since the Fogger WAS installed INTO the intake manifold, the lil holes they drilled for the nos jets could be considered a MOD to the ENGINE, but what if only a nos plate was used? then the engine wouldn't've been touched, right? or what if a big ol nos nozzle was stuck in the cold air intake tract before the engine's intake or anything? Just wonderin.......... Here's some of the NHRA rules: >From a team cam-arrow site: http://www.camaros.net/racing/rules.html Will get back to ya on the paragraph # about runnin an IRS at the track... Todd.... http://www.c-com.net/~atc457/toddlnk.htm David A. Cooley wrote: > > >In order to run under like 12's or so on most tracks, at least in the > >US, you can't even run an IRS rear end! > > And where in the NHRA rules does it state this? > > > > >How he's runnin 10's more tthan ONCE on any trrakc in America, if that's > >where he got the 10's at, is VERY RARE indeed! > > > > Again, Show me the NHRA rule that states an IRS is not allowed if you go > XX.XX or faster > > >Maybe at an ALL Z car rod run at the strip or somethin, but NHRA rules > >are NHRA rules.... no matter what the occasion... > > > >Maybe I'm missing somethin...? > > > >For example, I MUST be missing some sorta loop hole, cuz a BONE STOCK > >Viper GTS was runnin in the 10.1xx at teh Houston Raceway park track > >justa few months ago at the Hennessey Viper Shootout where 26 Vipers > >turned out as well as one trailered Vette, which I didn't see come off > >the trailor the entire time... Looked GREAT though... Was red and had > >custom rims n all.. > > > >Before ya get your panties in a bunch, I must add that the 10 second > >Viper was runnin lil slicks in the rear and front runners up front, and > >had a 400 shot a NOS! and TWO(2) mechanics messin with the plugs to > >verify correct nos/a/f mixture... > > > > That's not stock... Stock would have been without the Nitrous... > The factory Viper Fuel pump will not handle fuel flow for 800HP... there > had to be other aftermarket parts, and therefore was NOT stock. > > >He 'said' that the whole engine was STOCK!! except the nos injectors, a > >course! > > > > He lied... Double HP and it's bone stock... Crank and rods would have been > all over the track > Hennesey Motorsports builds vipers and in their advertisements, just to get > to 600 HP they have to replace pistons, rods, crank etc. (It's on their web > page!!) > > =========================================================== > David Cooley N5XMT Internet: N5XMT@xxx.net > Packet: N5XMT@xxx. Member #7068 > Sponges grow in the ocean... Wonder how deep it would be if they didn't?! > =========================================================== ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 May 1999 16:42:19 -0400 (EDT) From: William T Wilson Subject: Re: Getting loans.. (WAY off topic) On Fri, 28 May 1999, David A. Cooley wrote: > >So, what's Check Kiting? > > That's where you write a check, buy something get cash back, deposit the > cash in the bank, write another check etc... basically trying to write > checks and deposit the money to stay ahead of all the checks because there The difference is that with check kiting, if they catch you, you will end up without enough money to cover it all. In this little credit-building scheme, even if you stop making payments altogether, nobody is out any money because you put the money up in the first place. > of the loan and puts you in default. the money has to stay there > until the loan is paid off. It does, because you are using the money you borrowed from bank A as the collateral for bank B. No particular dollar actually gets used twice. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 May 1999 13:51:17 -0700 (PDT) From: Jim Davies Subject: Re: Prowler V6 On Fri, 28 May 1999, Todd....!! wrote: > Anybody in here ever ran FORGED steel pistons? or do most of ya'll only > run CAST iron pistons? > > Just wonderin what kinda answers I'll get from this.... > > I run forged hypereutectic myself, but a magnet won't stick to ANY of > em! > > Anyone know why? > You have to use a special magnet for these. Try SnapOn... ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 May 1999 13:51:14 -0700 From: "Eidson, Mark" Subject: RE: Location of intake air temperature sensor This is more what I would have expected to find, thanks, me. - -----Original Message----- From: green [mailto:green@xxx.com] Sent: Friday, May 28, 1999 12:33 PM To: diy_efi@xxx.edu Subject: Re: Location of intake air temperature sensor The SyTy system uses a MAT (manifold air temp) sensor. This is in the manifold itself, after the turbo. I'd think this is a good/bad thing. Bad, because it might be subject to heat soak of the manifold itself, but good because it is actually measuring the air going into the engine for fueling/timing calculations. So it would take into account turbo and intercooler efficiencies partially, as more/less fuel would be delivered, and more/less timing would be employed, versus the air temps. If the sensor was before the turbo, it might measure ambient only, while the air temps at the manifold would be much hotter, and vary a lot (i've seen them rise 50-100 degrees in a 1/4 run in a syty). It's interesting that the syty chip doesn't change fueling much versus the MAT temp..... here's the MAT temp fueling term table from the syty chips 0x04D1 F31M_TBLE Base Pulse Inverse Air Temp vs ADMAT (ACSP Senso Deg. K | Hot 136 107 91.0 80.0 71.0 63.0 56.0 49.3 43.3 37.0 30.5 23.5 15.5 6.0 -8.5 Cold - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- - ----------------------------------- (Deg. K)| 0x9B 0x9B 0x9B 0x9B 0x9B 0x9B 0x9B 0x9B 0x9B 0x9B 0x9B 0x9B 0x9B 0x9D 0x9F 0xA5 0xC0 I'd think there'd be a direct relationship here between temperature and fueling needs. There's also a nifty table that is timing vs MAT and vs boost 0x02D2 F3_TABLE Spark Advance Adjustment vs ADMAT1K Deg. vs Deg. C & kPa Boost | Cold 23.5 49.3 80.0 Hot - --------------------------------------- 0.0 | 20.04 20.04 20.04 20.04 20.04 12.5 | 20.04 20.04 20.04 20.04 20.04 25.0 | 20.04 20.04 20.04 20.04 20.04 37.5 | 20.04 20.04 20.04 20.04 20.04 50.0 | 20.04 20.04 20.04 20.04 20.04 62.5 | 20.04 20.04 20.04 20.04 20.04 75.0 | 20.04 20.04 18.98 16.87 20.04 87.5 | 20.04 20.04 17.93 15.82 20.04 100.0 | 16.87 16.87 16.87 14.77 14.77 Sorry if that looks goofy in the email.... Brian Green Syclone 160 |How does a MAP system compensate for the increased/reduced air temperature |resulting from the turbo and intercooler? me | |-----Original Message----- |From: David A. Cooley [mailto:n5xmt@xxx.net] |Sent: Friday, May 28, 1999 10:02 AM |To: diy_efi@xxx.edu |Subject: Re: Location of intake air temperature sensor | | |At 09:50 AM 5/28/99 -0700, you wrote: |>Where does the intake air temperature sensor go on a turbocharged and |>intercooled port injection system? me | |before the turbo... usually in the air filter box. |=========================================================== | David Cooley N5XMT Internet: N5XMT@xxx.net | Packet: N5XMT@xxx. Member #7068 | Sponges grow in the ocean... Wonder how deep it would be if they didn't?! |=========================================================== | ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 May 1999 15:35:56 -0700 From: "Todd....!!" Subject: More NHRA rules, but not the one were lookin for...Later...Todd... http://www.austintx.net/bigwig/txprahome/1999_PS_rules.htm ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 May 1999 13:58:02 -0700 (PDT) From: Jim Davies Subject: Re: Prowler V6 On Fri, 28 May 1999, Todd....!! wrote: > HOWEVER, up to the end of 72 ALL B/RB Mopars had FORGED cranks n rods, > period, this is a well know and documented fact.... > They started using cast cranks in the last year of 383 production. This crank was the most common 400 crank, too, although mopar says they put some forged [383] cranks in 400s. cant remember when 440s went to cast but it was about the time they started using 6 pack rods in all 440s. I think cast cranks are okay in these engines, based on my experience. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 May 1999 17:15:04 -0400 From: "David A. Cooley" Subject: Re: Prowler V6 At 02:15 PM 5/28/99 -0700, you wrote: >Thanks for that heads up about the steel cranks Jason!, > >I always check the crank, rods, n pistons PERSONALLY by eye to make SURE >they're a froging or casting, by the casting marks.... if the things >polished, I don't know HOW to tell for sure.... maybe see if a >magnet'll stick to it or somethin? haha...? Just kiddin, if the magnet >don't stick, then it's either some sorta alloy, or aluminum(Rods, not >crank) > >Just a quick general self-checker question: > >Anybody in here ever ran FORGED steel pistons? or do most of ya'll only >run CAST iron pistons? > >Just wonderin what kinda answers I'll get from this.... > >I run forged hypereutectic myself, but a magnet won't stick to ANY of >em! > >Anyone know why? Never seen a steel piston of any sort (Except for brake wheel cylinders or calipers...) Never seen forged and hypereutectic together before either... seen Hypereutectic cast aluminum, plain cast aluminum and forged aluminum =========================================================== David Cooley N5XMT Internet: N5XMT@xxx.net Packet: N5XMT@xxx. Member #7068 Sponges grow in the ocean... Wonder how deep it would be if they didn't?! =========================================================== ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 May 1999 15:56:37 -0700 From: "Todd....!!" Subject: Re: Prowler V6 Hey Fred, I hear ya about the chev engine's, haven't EVER even seen a s.b. or b.b. forged crank.... all I've ever seen and/or used were all CAST units! And forged rods? forget about it unless ya go to Mr. Pink... As for the b/rb motors specifically, ALL of em had forged cranks n rods from the begninning until early to mid 1973.... No grey area here, maybe the slant 6 or 4 or s.b. 8 bangers, but I'm not 'into' then and don't know bout em.......you the man on that.... Still can't get into your sites... What up with that? Do I need some sorta password or special browser or different dial up server (Internet connection) or what? Can't WAIT to see the hummer and the specs on the f.i.'d Turbo mopar! LATER! Todd..... http://www.c-com.net/~atc347/toddlnk.htm Frederic Breitwieser wrote: > > > So ya see, when ya say 'plain vanilla', back in the 60's and early 70's > > and some MAYBE EVEN NOW, ALL Mopars came with FORGED cranks and rods, > > wheras most others had meager cast units.... > > Mopar had a mix of cast and forged units over the years... and as the > product line aged into the 70's, the cast parts became more common. > Also not around this time due to emmission rules, the compression went > down as well. Maybe these two statements are related. > > > I've heard that most s.b. chev 4-bolt main blocks had forged cranks, but > > this hasn't been sildified/proven yet to me anyways, anybody? > > Some do some don't. > > One thing I will state about the Chevy engine, is its a bottom oiler, > whereas most ford/mopar engines are top oilers. This means in a Chevy > 350, the crank journals are oiled first. Interesting tidbit I got > from the local machine shop this morning. > > -- > > Frederic Breitwieser > Bridgeport CT 06606 > > 1993 Supercharged Lincoln Continental > 1989 HWMMV w/turbocharged 500cid Caddy > 1975 Dodge D200 Club Cab soon to have 431 stroker + turbos > 2000 (I hope) Buick GTP (Mid-Engined Sports Car) ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 May 1999 16:03:32 -0700 From: "Todd....!!" Subject: Re: Getting loans.. (WAY off topic) Pat, Your in Canada right? Isn't it normal for mortgage payments to be paid every two weeks instead of monthly as they usually are here in the states? This is what I've heard... I'm plannin on payin on my house's $690/mo payment TWICE a month instead of once a month... every 1st n 15th of the month I'll pay $690/2 or $350 (The extra $10 goes towards the priciple and will reduce the number of years it takes to pay the loan back) Just by doin the bi-monthly payments alone, the 30 year loan is reduced to 22 yrs... the extra $10/mo will make it less than 20 yrs, if I remember correctly... Lemme know kay? LATER! Todd....!! http://www.c-com.net/~atc347/toddlnk.htm Pat Ford wrote: > > Previously, you (Todd....!!) wrote: > > If ya calulate the interest on a $1,000 loan with an APR of, what, 10% > > MAX. > > > > Multiply $1,000 by 10%, this equals $100, then divide the $100 by 12 > > months in a year, this gives ya about $10/mo interest MAX. > > I think you may be forgetting that this is compounded interest > > using the rule of 72 the time required for the interest to double > is 7.2 years which is around $11.58 > > > > > The entire loan only lasts about 6 weeks so thats about $15 MAX for > > interest, however, since the loan is a SECURED loan SECURED with CASH > > MONEY in THEIR BANK, the interest rate should be less than a normal > > unsecured loans' interest would be... so the interest lost would be > > minimal... > > once you remove that deposit from the bank the loan is no longer a > secured loan. most banks ask that a deposit use as collatural be > "hypothicated"(sp??) which means it's still yours but you can't have > it. ( I bought a house while unemployed, the house was $120K, we > had $70k, and the bank made us deposit $10k and hypothicate the 10K > as security for mortgage payments) weird but true > > > > > THEN we must look at the BIG picture, we're building a repore with a > > bank which in the end will allow us to borrow money thru unsecured > > loans, which will allow us to purchase propertis that we would otherwise > > be unable to purchase.... > > banks up here have NO LOYALTY you are a cash cow once your milked off to > the slaughterhouse > > > > > The siz week loan period is to get within the visible loan length range > > where the banks and other lending institution will notice the loans... > > > > Any shorter length than 6 weeks will go unnoticed by most banks... > > > > Then the SUPER big picture is to be able to fund a f.i.'d twin turbo > > 451/440 project for the Superbee.... which is why I'm here learning as > > much as I can before doin any buying or investing in parts..... > > > > Take it easy!, > > > > Sincerely, > > > > Todd....!! > > http://www.c-com.net/~atc347/toddlnk.htm > > > > William T Wilson wrote: > > > > > > On Thu, 27 May 1999, Stegbauer, Michael wrote: > > > > > > > > Will be goin out and gettin loans using this $3,000 as my collateral in > > > > > several banks in series, i.e. deposit the $3000 in one bank, get a loan > > > > > using it as collateral, take the loan money from the first bank, deposit > > > > > it into another bank, get a loan on that money etc.... > > > > > > A stunt like this will cost you a fortune in interest. However, it's > > > mathematically sound. Basic economics class will demonstrate that exactly > > > the same phenomenon is already at work and makes the banking system go. > > > > > > It is marginally useful for building credit references, but otherwise, > > > won't do you much good. The credit bureaus know how much money you have > > > loaned out total, and they know how many loans you have, too. And, of > > > course, you have to pay the interest on the total amount you have > > > borrowed whether it is in small or large lumps. > > > > > > -- > Pat Ford email: pford@xxx.com > QNX Software Systems, Ltd. WWW: http://www.qnx.com > (613) 591-0931 (voice) mail: 175 Terrence Matthews > (613) 591-3579 (fax) Kanata, Ontario, Canada K2M 1W8 ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 May 1999 14:49:50 -0700 From: "Stegbauer, Michael" Subject: RE: Getting loans.. (WAY off topic) Todd, I'm assuming the bank runs a credit report and can see that you are getting a large number of small loans in a short amount of time. Even if they didn't notice that this looks alot like check kiting (not exactly the same thing), it would be really suspicious and they'd be pretty foolish to give a loan like that. I did get the impression from you original message that you were asking for more money with each loan, so maybe I've misunderstood something there. They might do it for a loan equal to the amount of cash but at some point you'd be asking for more money, right? (I don't remember the details of stage 2). Sooner or later I bet they'll start denying you on the number of credit inquiries alone. Good luck though! The cause is just. ;-) Anyway, have you tried heavier oil for your lifters? Whenever I showed up for an event, all the other DSMers would come over and tell me that I had the worst lifter tick they'd ever heard. Mobil 1 made it worse, but then I switched to the Valvoline Syntec(?) (full Synthetic) 5W-30 and the noise went away. I had to get it at PepBoys to start, but Walmart sells it now. I switch to the lighter stuff for winter and had a little tick occasionally at startup, but nothing to even think about. The lifters usually aren't a major problem anyway, though some people think they can trigger the knock sensor. It sounds like your compression is way low. The archives (search.dsm.org) suggest that most turbos read around 150. Cheers, Mike 92 AWD Laser - -----Original Message----- From: Todd....!! [mailto:atc347@xxx.net] Sent: Friday, May 28, 1999 11:14 AM To: diy_efi@xxx.edu Subject: Re: Getting loans.. (WAY off topic) Hello Michael, Stupid meaning what? Do you believe that a bank giving a 'loan' to someone who puts the exact same amount as the loan in a savings account at that bank for collateral as bing STUPID? They have NO risk whatsoever on that loan, plus they get the interest from the loan when all is said and done... That' sounds like a no risk type of loan to me as far as the bank's concerned.... I may not have conveyed the theory well.... ANY bank will give a loan for cash as long as you give them that same amount of cash in an account.... I'll let ya know how it goes.... The banker may ask why you would even want a loan if you already have the money, all ya have to tell em is that you have a hard time saving money, and that if it were in the form of a loan that you would have more of a reason to save the money, or somethin like that... Simple... Easy... Works... Purpose is to build repore and confidence with the lender... LATER! Todd.... - ----------- Stegbauer, Michael wrote: > > > Will be goin out and gettin loans using this $3,000 as my collateral in > > several banks in series, i.e. deposit the $3000 in one bank, get a loan > > using it as collateral, take the loan money from the first bank, deposit > > it into another bank, get a loan on that money etc.... > > > > Then mak 2 or 3 payments on each 'loan' over a 6 week period using the > > $3,000 'loan' money for payment money, then go back within about 6 weeks > > or so and pay all of em off, then ask for a signature loan from each > > bank for about the same amount...(signature meaning NO COLLATERAL!) and > > do the same thing with that signature loan money... This will build > > credit with the bank(s) as well as a relationship with em... > > Wow! I'm looking into buying some land. If the loan officers in > Houston are this stupid, maybe I should get a loan there. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 May 1999 17:57:40 -0400 From: Frederic Breitwieser Subject: Re: alternative engines, now Hemi > have to weigh the sucker! How much ya think, just for the block alone? Wild stab, 300-350 lbs. > It's good that you modified a B block intake, that means your goin with > the 451, ey? 431, but yes, check out http://xephic.dynip.com/dodge/dodge.html and off the menu thingys on the left you will find "EFI COnversion" and you can see what I brazed together. Plenum pictures aren't there yet, but the injector bungs are. Also, the fuel rails are done, but I have to take pictures also. > Go to http://www.c-com.net/~atc347/451/ and view what a dude who's Bookmakred... going later! > The main journal size may not be afactor, especially if ya just align > bore the mains in the block instead of cut the mains down on the crank! > Like Keith black does with most of his high dollar strokers.... line boring eliminates misaligned bores... whole purpose of this process. Turning down the 440 crank to a 383 or 400 engine is not a big deal, and you have the same crank strength as the 383/400 crank assuming both are cast, or both are forged, or both are steel. Gotta compare apples to apples :) ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 May 1999 15:09:36 -0700 From: "soren" Subject: Re: Turbo'd s.b. chev...in a 69 Camaro? maybe? - --- >Matter of fact, I wonder if ANY big car manufacturer even offers any >cars which are turbo equipped without an intercooler? > >Anyone? Probably not right now, but recently (recent in the timeline of automotive technology, I think mostly the 1980s) Chrysler, Mitsubishi, Subaru, Buick, are the ones I have personally seen that have no stock intercooler. And they did know about intercoolers then, evidently those particular models didn't require them. I suppose that the masses who are used to naturally aspirated performance might rather have a low-boost, low-lag system where the turbo pushes air through about one foot of intake piping instead of 6 ft. Soren ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 May 1999 15:39:39 -0700 (PDT) From: Jim Davies Subject: Re: Prowler V6 On Fri, 28 May 1999, David A. Cooley wrote: > Never seen a steel piston of any sort (Except for brake wheel cylinders or > calipers...) Some early aircraft engines used steel pistons. Cast iron pistons, of course, WERE common in automobile engines way back when. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 May 1999 18:07:18 -0400 From: Frederic Breitwieser Subject: Re: Prowler V6 > I hear ya about the chev engine's, haven't EVER even seen a s.b. or b.b. > forged crank.... all I've ever seen and/or used were all CAST units! I'm not a chevy guy, so I can't confirm/refute. I have a friend's 350 in the garage, maybe I should rip it apart on him "for testing purposes" LOL > Still can't get into your sites... Was up this morning, I"ll reboot the server in a few. Mail obviously works. Hey, its NT, very finicky. > Do I need some sorta password or special browser or different dial up > server (Internet connection) or what? Nope, nothing other than a left handed smoke shifter. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 May 1999 16:00:15 -0700 (PDT) From: Jim Davies Subject: Re: Turbo'd s.b. chev...in a 69 Camaro? maybe? On Fri, 28 May 1999, soren wrote: > Probably not right now, but recently (recent in the timeline of > automotive technology, I think mostly the 1980s) Chrysler, Mitsubishi, > Subaru, Buick, are the ones I have personally seen that have no stock > intercooler. And they did know about intercoolers then, evidently those > particular models didn't require them. I suppose that the masses who are > used to naturally aspirated performance might rather have a low-boost, > low-lag system where the turbo pushes air through about one foot of intake > piping instead of 6 ft. > Most first-generation [meaning in the 1980s] car turbo systems were non-intercooled. Later ones were sometimes air-to-air intercooled. A few were liquid-to-air-intercooled. It roughly followed the "rule of 7" -- non-intercooled meant max boost about 7 psi, air intercooled meant max boost about 14 psi, liquid intercooled about 21 psi. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 May 1999 16:00:17 -0700 From: Bill Edgeworth Subject: Re: Prowler V6 Cast cranks were introduced in late 1971 in the 383-2Bbl and were used in all 72-78 400's except some (not all) 72-74 400-4Bbl The cast crank was first used in the 440 in 74 Over 3 million 383's were produced through 1971 and 3/4 million 440's (forged crank motor's) I dont know the numbers for the 400. Bill Edgeworth > > So ya see, when ya say 'plain vanilla', back in the 60's and early 70's > and some MAYBE EVEN NOW, ALL Mopars came with FORGED cranks and rods, > wheras most others had meager cast units.... ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 May 1999 18:13:02 -0500 From: Tom Sharpe Subject: Re: NC: 2.9X posi IRS pumpking donor/halfshaft q? Ross Corrigan wrote: > So any ideas/thoughts at all on the halfshaft fabrication (other donor > telescoping parts? our Z ones are too weak for him Any 4WD drive shaft!! Tom S ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 May 1999 18:26:12 -0500 From: Tom Sharpe Subject: Off list Hi all. I'm on vacation in Israel for two weeks so no replies for at least 16 days. I'll say a prayer at the wall for Dr. Bruce. To all who sent Bins for disassembly - what a challenge, most are not the same as the old Mustang and HC11 that I started with, requiring much tweaking... I'll be back on them soon. PS. I got some small parts from BGMicro(.com) They have lots of unusual things and prices and good service. Best of luck to all - no replies please. Tom Sharpe ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 May 1999 16:39:41 -0700 From: Bill Edgeworth Subject: Re: Prowler V6 > Mopar had some tuners-tips > mods to A block systems that included reamed and sleeving the primary > lifter bore feed circuit. I have seen this for Roller cammed small blocks where you remove the plug for the oil galley from the block drill it out and push in a brass or copper tube. Then the section of the tube sticking out into the lifter bore has to be pushed in using a old lifter with a radiused end. You then have to redrill all intersecting oil passages. Actually you enlarge most of them. You also have to block off part of the front left galley. If you do not do this on the LA engine with a roller cam your oil pressure will be to low. Kind of seems scary to me that the only oil the lifters see is from splash, drain back or windage after this mod. Bill Edgeworth ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 29 May 1999 01:46:39 +0200 From: "Espen Hilde" Subject: software changes Hi List! If I have a car with a GM ECU and wants to make changes in the software to make it better suited for turbo charging , how can this be done? Espen Hilde My ToyZ : Motion 25fot cat 2 * 2,5 Mercury Efi offshore (Just made fuel catch tanks for it)( Anyone who knows anything about the efi system on thise engines?They say the ecu is analog....ęsj ...( sucks in Norwegian....) I need a tow car for this boat , is your turbo Hummer for sale Frederic? 69 NSU 1000 TT (1850ccm turbo) VW offroad buggy.50 hp...... 22 fot Gilbert ,tuned 225 hp Yamaha .sport boat 74 knots :-) 1/10 of a Mastercraft barefoot waterski boat. :\/\/\/: =Best fun there is! 2 RC Boats 3 RC Cars 1 RC cox engine with crashing sail plane.... 1 pair Ice hookey skates etc............. Going to hit the water this summer?......Maybe I must learn some real estate...... ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 May 1999 20:20:01 -0400 From: "Bruce Plecan" Subject: Re: software changes - ----- Original Message ----- From: Espen Hilde To: Sent: Friday, May 28, 1999 7:46 PM Subject: software changes MAF, or MAP? What car?. What ecm?. Generally would be easier to switch ecms for one that is a turbo application. If MAF them doing a MAF change, and recalibration might be possible in theory. If MAP can be crudely done, if a haced ecm. Grumpy | Hi List! | If I have a car with a GM ECU and wants to make changes in the software | to make it better suited for turbo charging , how can this be done? | Espen Hilde | | My ToyZ : | Motion 25fot cat 2 * 2,5 Mercury Efi offshore (Just made fuel catch tanks | for it)( Anyone who knows anything about the efi system on thise | engines?They say the ecu is analog....ęsj ...( sucks in Norwegian....) | I need a tow car for this boat , is your turbo Hummer for sale Frederic? | 69 NSU 1000 TT (1850ccm turbo) | VW offroad buggy.50 hp...... | 22 fot Gilbert ,tuned 225 hp Yamaha .sport boat 74 knots :-) | 1/10 of a Mastercraft barefoot waterski boat. :\/\/\/: =Best fun there is! | 2 RC Boats | 3 RC Cars | 1 RC cox engine with crashing sail plane.... | 1 pair Ice hookey skates | etc............. | | Going to hit the water this summer?......Maybe I must learn some real | estate...... | | ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 May 1999 19:42:03 -0500 From: Thomas McCabe Subject: Re: Prowler V6 Jim Davies wrote: > > On Fri, 28 May 1999, Todd....!! wrote: > > > Anybody in here ever ran FORGED steel pistons? or do most of ya'll only > > run CAST iron pistons? > > > > Just wonderin what kinda answers I'll get from this.... > > > > I run forged hypereutectic myself, but a magnet won't stick to ANY of > > em! > > > > Anyone know why? > > > You have to use a special magnet for these. Try SnapOn... OK, Most pistons are ALUMINUM, forged or cast. I've personally never seen a STEEL piston. My .02 L8r - -- Thomas McCabe - -mccabet@xxx.net '85 D250, 340 on Propane, Auto '89 Lebaron GTC, 2.2L Turbo II, A-555 5 Speed, MPSBEC '91 Spirit R/T, 2.2L DOHC 16 Valve T3, A568 5 Speed, Anti-lock Brakes, Power Windows, Locks, Drivers Seat. '96 Dakota SLT Club Cab, Brilliant Blue, 5.2L, Auto, 3.55 SG, Gibson Cat-Back Exhaust, ARE A-234 15x7 rims w/ Dunlop GT Qualifiers 255R60-15, Molded running boards and flares, Lund bug shield, Cool Fronts, Ventvisors, and Extang Saber Tonnue cover. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 29 May 1999 10:37:38 +1000 From: Peter Gargano Subject: Re: Getting loans.. (WAY off topic) Peter D. Hipson wrote: > Open an account at bank A, with $100. Go to bank B, open an account, with [snip] >write a check on A, for $75, deposite in B. >immediately before the first check clears, [snip] I can't see how cheque "kiting" can work in the real world these days? What kind of bank has a zero cheque clearance period? Any bank I know will only give you cash up to the value of your "cleared" funds. Actually, (in Australia) if you deposit cash and ask for a bank cheque, then deposit that cheque in another bank, the second bank will (as with all cheques, bank or otherwise) impose a clearance period, UNLESS you ask for immediate clearance requiring a bank fee ($20 sort of figure). This is the case even if the banks are right beside each other. It's just like the casino - the banks can't lose! regards, - -- Peter Gargano ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 May 1999 20:47:27 -0400 From: Frederic Breitwieser Subject: To Todd Just rebooted... server's up. Happy surfing. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 May 1999 17:58:21 -0700 From: Ross Corrigan Subject: Re: NC: 2.9X posi IRS pumpking donor/halfshaft q? At 10:21 AM 5/28/99 -0700, you wrote: >OK Ross... > >In order to run under like 12's or so on most tracks, at least in the >US, you can't even run an IRS rear end! > I"m not up on 1/4 miles rules but what I've heard several times is sub 10's requires solid axle or I'd have several more friends checking this out d/2 requirements rather than fun! Ross Corrigan / Vancouver, Canada '80 327ZX IZCC#255, Edmonton Z-car Club #44, British Columbia ZCR Life's a journey, not a destination.. Enjoy the pitstops and maximize the straights mailto:zxv@xxx.ca *New ICQ # 11549358 http://home.iSTAR.ca/~zxv/index.shtml http://207.212.212.139/~corrigan/gearheads/pics/wheels/sirbg.jpg where a Z belongs ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 May 1999 19:03:35 -0700 (PDT) From: Jim Davies Subject: Re: Prowler V6 On Fri, 28 May 1999, Bill Edgeworth wrote: > I have seen this for Roller cammed small blocks where you remove the plug for > the oil galley from the block drill it out and push in a brass or copper tube. > Then the section of the tube sticking out into the lifter bore has to be > pushed in using a old lifter with a radiused end. You then have to redrill all > intersecting oil passages. Actually you enlarge most of them. This is the scary part for me because of the small amount of core shift that will give you a cracked block especially in a high revver... > Kind of seems scary to me that the only oil the lifters see is from splash, > drain back or windage after this mod. > Keep the revs above 2000 and it should give reasonable durability... ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 29 May 1999 04:05:39 +0200 From: "Espen Hilde" Subject: Re: software changes Good to see you there on the list Bruce! Have you accepted to do the surgery? Then go for it, dont worry ,it wount help you ....To worry is like shooting yourself in the back of your head , a guy running a dyno told me ...I was worrying about if the engine would blow apart.The engine screeming in the other room, glowing reed, terrifying.....whosh the coolant boiled, Is the engine a wreck....no its ok...puuuhhhhh. You just have to accept whats coming if you have decided...(easy for me to say....) Not easy to do software changes in the human brain.........:-) > MAF, or MAP? > What car?. > What ecm?. > Generally would be easier to switch ecms for one that is a turbo > application. > If MAF them doing a MAF change, and recalibration might be possible in > theory. > If MAP can be crudely done, if a haced ecm. > Grumpy Its just a minds game...how is it done to make new features in an ECUs program? Do you have to know what type of language its written in? Have to know how to program offcurse....... if I wanted to make a table for filtering the map signal for different points in the working aria. but its maybe there allready? Espen ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 May 1999 22:29:51 -0400 From: "CLsnyder" Subject: Re: O/T Compression ratio and supercharging, also efi pumps LL100 has over twice the maximum amount of lead ever used in automotive pump gas. No problem with burning valves from lack of lead, but quite possibly a problem with sticking valves due to lead deposit buildup on stems. Common problem on some air-cooled aviation engines designed for the older avgas. - ----- Original Message ----- From: Todd....!! To: Sent: Friday, May 28, 1999 5:03 PM Subject: Re: O/T Compression ratio and supercharging, also efi pumps > Hi David, > > Thanks for the info... > > However, as far as the lead content, buds said that the AVGas was kinda > 'dry' and that I shouldn't run the AVGas too long so as to not burn the > valves up... > > But if you read your source on the net, then it must be true, ey? lol > > LATER! > > Todd....!! > http://www.c-com.net/~atc347/toddlnk.htm > > > David A. Cooley wrote: > > > > At 09:55 AM 5/28/99 -0700, you wrote: > > >FYI - I ran AVgas(Aviation fuel) right from outa the airplane fueler > > >tanker (They DIDN'T USE THE GROUND STRAP FROM THE TANKER TO THE CAR, but > > >DID on all the planes, that coulda hurt!) into my 73 Camaro with a 383 > > >stroker, closed chambered small valve heads(1.94), Edelbrock tunnelram > > >w/ dual 600 vac holleys, 4-speed, and 3.73 limited slip 10-bolt rear... > > >was at about 10.5:1 compression... first 5 gallons in the new motor were > > >AVGAS, as were the next few tanks.... kinda expensive... started mixin > > >super and avgas, then went to straight superunleaded(93 octane)... > > > > > >Everyone told me it was only 100 octane, the exhaust smelled like race > > >gas to me.... > > > > They don't rate AV gas octane the same as regular gas... 100LL av gas is > > about 105-110 octane in automotive terms... It also has MORE lead (even > > though it says low lead) than any automotive leaded fuel (Almost twice the > > amount) > > Check out the Gasoline FAQ on the net... Pretty good info there. > > =========================================================== > > David Cooley N5XMT Internet: N5XMT@xxx.net > > Packet: N5XMT@xxx. Member #7068 > > Sponges grow in the ocean... Wonder how deep it would be if they didn't?! > > =========================================================== > > > ------------------------------ End of DIY_EFI Digest V4 #317 ***************************** To subscribe to DIY_EFI-Digest, send the command: subscribe diy_efi-digest in the body of a message to "Majordomo@xxx. A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to subscribe to that instead, replace "diy_efi-digest" in the command above with "diy_efi".