DIY_EFI Digest Wednesday, June 2 1999 Volume 04 : Number 328 In this issue: Re: To Todd Re: 2.9X posi IRS pumpking donor/halfshaft q? Re: Knock sensors Re: Prowler V6 Re: Types of differentials/Traction aiding devices Re: Prowler V6 Re: Prowler V6 Re: Types of differentials/Traction aiding devices Re: To Todd Re: Prowler V6 Re: Prowler V6 RE: Re: Diff types Re: To Todd Re: (promedit) Re: Knock sensors Re: Turbo'd s.b. chev...in a 69 Camaro? maybe? Re: Turbo'd s.b. chev...in a 69 Camaro? maybe? Re: Prowler V6 now ESB Re: Types of differentials/Traction aiding devices Re: Prowler V6 Re: Prowler V6 Re: Types of differentials/Traction aiding devices Re: Injectors Re: 730 program Re: Turbo'd s.b. chev...in a 69 Camaro? maybe? Re: Injectors See the end of the digest for information on subscribing to the DIY_EFI or DIY_EFI-Digest mailing lists. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 02 Jun 1999 15:41:25 -0400 From: Frederic Breitwieser Subject: Re: To Todd > Are you usin a 110 Mig welder to weld your patch panels are are ya just > leadin em in or just brazin? I purchased last fall a Lincoln 170T wire-feed MIG welder, which uses 220V at about 45 amps if I remember the data on the cord correctly... installed a 60A 220V industrial outlet (versus a dryer outlet) and gave it its own breaker. > I'm lookin at getten a lil 110 mig for the house, and am lookin into em > right now... I checked them out as well... and didn't really like any of them for my application, which is building a mid-engine car from scratch - I have a lot of tubing to weld together and panels, firewalls, etc, so something more heavy duty was important. These things are not only rated in voltage/current output, but also duty cycle... keep that in mind. If a particular unit can give you 30A at a 30% duty cycle, that means you can weld for a minute, then wait three. Stepping up a size, could be rated at 50A at the same duty cycle, which means if you only need 30A, you now have a much higher duty cycle. For welding mild steel, I welded two 8' strips together in one long swoop, because the machine was slightly oversized for the job - so I had the current turned down about half way, which increased the duty cycle significantly. I really like this unit (170T), and if you have access to 220V in your garage/home/yard, its not that expensive either. Figure about a grand for the unit, gun and cable, then on top of that you'd need a face shield, and a display filter (shade) of your choice, leather gloves and preferably a leather apron. My total bill with a huge spool of flux-core welding wire (no gas bottles, but a lot of slag grinding) ended up being about 1300 bucks or so. > Have a few projects I want to do that will require weldin, and I don't > wanna keep on borrowin the neighbors... ya know? Yep, I hear ya. I have the reverse problem. I'm the first in the little townhouse complex to have a welder, so I've been "asked" by a few people to weld little trailer brackets back on, etc, mostly minor stuff. No one's been brave enough to bring by a rust-bucket that needs its quarters cut and welded. - -- Frederic Breitwieser Bridgeport CT 06606 1993 Supercharged Lincoln Continental 1989 HWMMV w/turbocharged 500cid Caddy 1975 Dodge D200 Club Cab soon to have 431 stroker + turbos 2000 (I hope) Buick GTP (Mid-Engined Sports Car) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 02 Jun 1999 16:19:06 -0400 From: Shannen Durphey Subject: Re: 2.9X posi IRS pumpking donor/halfshaft q? Jim Davies wrote: > > On Sat, 29 May 1999, Shannen Durphey wrote: > > > Jim Davies wrote: > > > > Corvette never used any Dana 60s. > > There's an optional diff, like a Dana 53. > > Shannen > > > > > What years and engines? The 44 was the heavy duty rear, and the 36 was the light duty version. Years listed are 84-94. I was thinking of the 36, as it's an unusual # to me. Shannen ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 02 Jun 1999 15:15:39 -0500 From: steve ravet Subject: Re: Don.F.Broadus@xxx.com wrote: > > I have tried to down load the 747 Bins into promedit but had zero luck. Is > there a procedure to copy a bin then load it into > promedit ? I do not have any experience with these programs. > Thanks for your help To download bins, go to the main site (efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu), click on diy_efi, click on "ftp site index", then click on the file you want to download. Netscape should prompt you for a filename. As far as getting it into promedit or tuna, you'll have to check the readme for each. It's been a while since I used them and I don't recall the command line for either. > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: steve ravet [SMTP:Steve.Ravet@xxx.com] > > Sent: Wednesday, June 02, 1999 9:45 AM > > To: diy_efi@xxx.edu > > Subject: Re: > > > > > > > > Geffro wrote: > > > > > > Hi folks > > > I've been searching the diy--efi website without much luck > > > Have read prog 101 but i dont understand any of it > > > eg > > > > > > The PROM has tables and some program code. It maps into processor space > > > from 0xd000 to 0xdfff. The ROM appears in the processor space from > > 0xe000 to > > > 0xffff. Data space in the PROM is from 0x000 to 0x616. Code starts at > > 0x617 > > > and continues to the end of the PROM, 0xfff. > > > > > > So to learn this where do i go ? > > > > Well, I hate to say it but read through the archives, searching for > > programming 101. Also read the tuning tips document which describes how > > it all works together. And pay attention to what comes across the gmecm > > list. > > > > Also download some of the 747 bins and run them through either promedit > > or tuna. That way you can actually see some of the tables, see how > > spark timing varies by load and rpm, etc. > > > > > I have collected a few proms that I'd like to read. > > > So can you good folk > > > tell me what I need > > > Is a prom reader an emulator and burner?cause i'd like to buy one > > > > A reader/programmer is different from an emulator. You need a > > reader/programmer, the emulator is nice but not necessary. > > > > --steve > > > > > whatever so i can start to work thiis out > > > Cheers > > > Geoff > > > > -- > > Steve Ravet > > steve.ravet@xxx.com > > Advanced Risc Machines, Inc. > > www.arm.com - -- Steve Ravet steve.ravet@xxx.com Advanced Risc Machines, Inc. www.arm.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 02 Jun 1999 14:41:52 -0700 From: Bill Edgeworth Subject: Knock sensors Hi all, I am adapting a 730 to a Mopar RB engine and I have some questions about Knock sensors: How sensitive are knock sensors to noise generated by gear drives? If they are affected would selection solve the problem? ( for instance a knock sensor off a factory supercharged engine) What about noise from mechanical (roller cams)? Bill Edgeworth ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 02 Jun 1999 17:50:34 -0400 From: Shannen Durphey Subject: Re: Prowler V6 Frederic Breitwieser wrote: > > > Well... Yeah :) I keep it in my metric tool drawer, next to > >the metric hammer and the metric crescent wrench ;) > > metric? What's that? you mean you guys don't use SAE wrenches and a > large 5lb sledge to make the wrench fit? > > > According to my Industrial sized BFH hammer scale, 5lbs is "moderate". Large is around 10 lbs. Shannen > -- > > Frederic Breitwieser > Bridgeport CT 06606 > > 1993 Supercharged Lincoln Continental > 1989 HWMMV w/turbocharged 500cid Caddy > 1975 Dodge D200 Club Cab soon to have 431 stroker + turbos > 2000 (I hope) Buick GTP (Mid-Engined Sports Car) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 02 Jun 1999 16:23:42 -0700 From: "Todd....!!" Subject: Re: Types of differentials/Traction aiding devices If the stuff inside the Dana 60 came with the Dana in 1970 on the Dodge Superbee, what would it be, I can't remember, it's been quite a while... I DO know that it has clutches in it... Any ideas? LATER! Todd.... - -------------- Charles Brooks wrote: > > Please understand this is not meant as a sarcastic reply! > > The type of posi is NOT dictated by the type of rear it's in or made for. There are limited slip, Torsen and locking differentials made for the Dana 60. If you want to know what type of unit is in the rear you'll have to actually look at it. > > Charles Brooks > > ---------- Original Message ---------------------------------- > From: "Todd....!!" > Reply-To: diy_efi@xxx.edu > Date: Wed, 02 Jun 1999 08:24:17 -0700 > > >Hey C. > > Does the Dana 60's posi unit fall within any of the four types of rears > ya mentioned? And if so, which? it has clutches... whereas the 8 3/4 > posi's have either clutches or the cone(non-clutch) type posi... > > Just wonderinnnnnnnn..... > > Todd.... > > ---------- > > C. Brooks wrote: > > > > Hey BUDDY, I happen to like my metric hammer! And I do know the difference > > between Open, Limited Slip, Locking, and Torsen Differentials too! > > > > ;) > > > > Charles Brooks ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 02 Jun 1999 16:28:15 -0700 From: "Todd....!!" Subject: Re: Prowler V6 Hey Fred, Just wonderin, Is your Hummer mostly metric or SAE? AND will/is your 2000 Fred-mobile gonna be metric or sae or mostly which? Just wonderinnnnnnn...... Todd....... - ----------- Frederic Breitwieser wrote: > > > And seeing as how most of freds rides are American built n all, I'd have > > to say that he was REALLY only 3/4 serious... > > Are you kidding? The Lincoln uses more metric than SAE!!! The 75 > Dodge truck is all SAE of course. > > -- > > Frederic Breitwieser > Bridgeport CT 06606 > > 1993 Supercharged Lincoln Continental > 1989 HWMMV w/turbocharged 500cid Caddy > 1975 Dodge D200 Club Cab soon to have 431 stroker + turbos > 2000 (I hope) Buick GTP (Mid-Engined Sports Car) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 02 Jun 1999 17:54:26 -0400 From: Shannen Durphey Subject: Re: Prowler V6 Todd....!! wrote: > > It's true.... > > That the almighty crescent wrench may be used for multiple tasks... I once found a crescent that had been lying beside the road for years. It was rusted solid, and no amount of effort could free up the thumbwheel. Alas, it was a one size fits-all. Shannen ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 02 Jun 1999 16:30:41 -0700 From: "Todd....!!" Subject: Re: Types of differentials/Traction aiding devices Can ya do a W.O.T. launch with the button OFF, then turn it on in the middle of the launch, under FULL TORQUE? Just how strong is this unit? AND, would a car with one of these air posi's get better gas mileage with the posi OFF than it would with the air-posi on? Just wondrinnnnn......... LATER! Todd....!! Frederic Breitwieser wrote: > > > The type of posi is NOT dictated by the type of rear it's in or made for. There are limited slip, Torsen and locking differentials made for the Dana 60. If you want to know what type of unit is in the rear you'll have to actually look at it. > > And this is not a sarcastic response, either :) > > I'd highly recommend an ARB airlocker for this rear. direct bolt in, > easy to control with a pushbutton, and totally open when needed. > > -- > > Frederic Breitwieser > Bridgeport CT 06606 > > 1993 Supercharged Lincoln Continental > 1989 HWMMV w/turbocharged 500cid Caddy > 1975 Dodge D200 Club Cab soon to have 431 stroker + turbos > 2000 (I hope) Buick GTP (Mid-Engined Sports Car) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 02 Jun 1999 16:37:35 -0700 From: "Todd....!!" Subject: Re: To Todd Hi Fred, Thanks for the pricing... That's REALLY high, in my book... and I'm SURE that YOU got GREAT deals on everything! Did ya get a Lincoln, or what brand? I don't remember ya mentionin? ALSO, I thought I could get away with a lil 110V mig from Sam's or somethin for less than $200! Or am I just WAY WAY rusty on my pricing? MAybe I can pickup a used one at a pawn shop or somethin...til I strike it rich with the real estate n all... REALLY wanna build a Defender (Yes, from the Viper Series) and maybe a Prowler on a Camaro or equiv chassis.... Sell em for $10,000 or so ea... Buyer's choice of engine/drivetrain... Hemi would be a natural in the sucker, but anything goes, when ya have a welder, right? Whadayatink? LATER! Todd.... Frederic Breitwieser wrote: > > > Are you usin a 110 Mig welder to weld your patch panels are are ya just > > leadin em in or just brazin? > > I purchased last fall a Lincoln 170T wire-feed MIG welder, which uses > 220V at about 45 amps if I remember the data on the cord correctly... > installed a 60A 220V industrial outlet (versus a dryer outlet) and > gave it its own breaker. > > > I'm lookin at getten a lil 110 mig for the house, and am lookin into em > > right now... > > I checked them out as well... and didn't really like any of them for > my application, which is building a mid-engine car from scratch - I > have a lot of tubing to weld together and panels, firewalls, etc, so > something more heavy duty was important. These things are not only > rated in voltage/current output, but also duty cycle... keep that in > mind. If a particular unit can give you 30A at a 30% duty cycle, that > means you can weld for a minute, then wait three. Stepping up a size, > could be rated at 50A at the same duty cycle, which means if you only > need 30A, you now have a much higher duty cycle. > > For welding mild steel, I welded two 8' strips together in one long > swoop, because the machine was slightly oversized for the job - so I > had the current turned down about half way, which increased the duty > cycle significantly. > > I really like this unit (170T), and if you have access to 220V in your > garage/home/yard, its not that expensive either. Figure about a grand > for the unit, gun and cable, then on top of that you'd need a face > shield, and a display filter (shade) of your choice, leather gloves > and preferably a leather apron. My total bill with a huge spool of > flux-core welding wire (no gas bottles, but a lot of slag grinding) > ended up being about 1300 bucks or so. > > > Have a few projects I want to do that will require weldin, and I don't > > wanna keep on borrowin the neighbors... ya know? > > Yep, I hear ya. I have the reverse problem. I'm the first in the > little townhouse complex to have a welder, so I've been "asked" by a > few people to weld little trailer brackets back on, etc, mostly minor > stuff. No one's been brave enough to bring by a rust-bucket that > needs its quarters cut and welded. > > -- > > Frederic Breitwieser > Bridgeport CT 06606 > > 1993 Supercharged Lincoln Continental > 1989 HWMMV w/turbocharged 500cid Caddy > 1975 Dodge D200 Club Cab soon to have 431 stroker + turbos > 2000 (I hope) Buick GTP (Mid-Engined Sports Car) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 02 Jun 1999 18:15:05 -0400 From: Shannen Durphey Subject: Re: Prowler V6 Ross Corrigan wrote: > >Also, there was a 68 or 69 large journal 307 or 327 offered with > >forged crank, tho I don't remember the details. Just remember going > > Line I've been fed is the 300+ (not 300, only above) hp 327's got forged > cranks in the large journal setups. Read this more than once now in the > chevy mags. Rest large journals were cast. My serial # matches a 325hp > version but I didn't know enough when I did my quick re and re to check > that part out to verify. This is only for 327's. Found a casting# site. This shows forged, 325hp, 69 327. http://www.mortec.com/ In a mild street motor, ya get bragging rights. Some GM cranks had hardened journals, but I don't know which, if any, were factory installed. Hardening was not too deep. Machinists tell me that a regrind usually removed it, and finding a less than pristine used treated crank is no better than a non treated one. Shannen ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 02 Jun 1999 18:30:58 -0400 From: Frederic Breitwieser Subject: Re: Prowler V6 > Is your Hummer mostly metric or SAE? The Hummer is completely SAE, at least on all "assemblies". Inside the tranny & diff, prolly SAE, but these parts were bolted on rather than taken apart. Remember, this is not a "pay 60 grand" hummer, but rather a built one. So, everything was pretty much SAE. > AND will/is your 2000 Fred-mobile gonna be metric or sae or mostly > which? Its a mix. Buick Engine, Audi Transaxle, Corvette Suspension are their own, (mostly SAE), and all the fabricated stuff lucky enough to get a fastener will be SAE. - -- Frederic Breitwieser Bridgeport CT 06606 1993 Supercharged Lincoln Continental 1989 HWMMV w/turbocharged 500cid Caddy 1975 Dodge D200 Club Cab soon to have 431 stroker + turbos 2000 (I hope) Buick GTP (Mid-Engined Sports Car) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 2 Jun 1999 17:24:20 -0500 From: Don.F.Broadus@xxx.com Subject: RE: Thanks Steve; I will give it a try, appreciate your help Don > -----Original Message----- > From: steve ravet [SMTP:Steve.Ravet@xxx.com] > Sent: Wednesday, June 02, 1999 3:16 PM > To: diy_efi@xxx.edu > Subject: Re: > > > > Don.F.Broadus@xxx.com wrote: > > > > I have tried to down load the 747 Bins into promedit but had zero luck. > Is > > there a procedure to copy a bin then load it into > > promedit ? I do not have any experience with these programs. > > Thanks for your > help > > To download bins, go to the main site (efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu), click > on diy_efi, click on "ftp site index", then click on the file you want > to download. Netscape should prompt you for a filename. > > As far as getting it into promedit or tuna, you'll have to check the > readme for each. It's been a while since I used them and I don't recall > the command line for either. > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: steve ravet [SMTP:Steve.Ravet@xxx.com] > > > Sent: Wednesday, June 02, 1999 9:45 AM > > > To: diy_efi@xxx.edu > > > Subject: Re: > > > > > > > > > > > > Geffro wrote: > > > > > > > > Hi folks > > > > I've been searching the diy--efi website without much luck > > > > Have read prog 101 but i dont understand any of it > > > > eg > > > > > > > > The PROM has tables and some program code. It maps into processor > space > > > > from 0xd000 to 0xdfff. The ROM appears in the processor space from > > > 0xe000 to > > > > 0xffff. Data space in the PROM is from 0x000 to 0x616. Code starts > at > > > 0x617 > > > > and continues to the end of the PROM, 0xfff. > > > > > > > > So to learn this where do i go ? > > > > > > Well, I hate to say it but read through the archives, searching for > > > programming 101. Also read the tuning tips document which describes > how > > > it all works together. And pay attention to what comes across the > gmecm > > > list. > > > > > > Also download some of the 747 bins and run them through either > promedit > > > or tuna. That way you can actually see some of the tables, see how > > > spark timing varies by load and rpm, etc. > > > > > > > I have collected a few proms that I'd like to read. > > > > So can you good folk > > > > tell me what I need > > > > Is a prom reader an emulator and burner?cause i'd like to buy one > > > > > > A reader/programmer is different from an emulator. You need a > > > reader/programmer, the emulator is nice but not necessary. > > > > > > --steve > > > > > > > whatever so i can start to work thiis out > > > > Cheers > > > > Geoff > > > > > > -- > > > Steve Ravet > > > steve.ravet@xxx.com > > > Advanced Risc Machines, Inc. > > > www.arm.com > > -- > Steve Ravet > steve.ravet@xxx.com > Advanced Risc Machines, Inc. > www.arm.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 2 Jun 1999 15:41:41 -0700 (PDT) From: Jim Davies Subject: Re: Diff types On Wed, 2 Jun 1999, SPECTRO COATING CORP. wrote: > Actually - Torsen was the manufacturer - Bob (I think that's his first name) > Gleason invented that differential design. Zexel was the manufacturer last i > knew. > Last name was actually Gleasman, but he changed it to Gleason. Also known for hypoid gearing... ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 02 Jun 1999 18:31:09 -0700 From: rr Subject: Re: To Todd Frederic Breitwieser wrote: > have a lot of tubing to weld together and panels, firewalls, etc, so > something more heavy duty was important. These things are not only > rated in voltage/current output, but also duty cycle... keep that in > mind. If a particular unit can give you 30A at a 30% duty cycle, that > means you can weld for a minute, then wait three. Stepping up a size, > could be rated at 50A at the same duty cycle, which means if you only > need 30A, you now have a much higher duty cycle. > Apologise(sp!) in advance for the interruption, welder duty cycle is based on a ten minute period. 30% gives three minutes of welding to seven minutes of cool down time. The real duty cycle is typically a taper, like 20% at max output, to 100% at 1/3 of the max output, or something like that. BobR. (Who him-self couldn't find out this info for a looonnnggg time...) > few people to weld little trailer brackets back on, etc, mostly minor > stuff. No one's been brave enough to bring by a rust-bucket that > needs its quarters cut and welded. > > -- > > Frederic Breitwieser > Bridgeport CT 06606 > > 1993 Supercharged Lincoln Continental > 1989 HWMMV w/turbocharged 500cid Caddy > 1975 Dodge D200 Club Cab soon to have 431 stroker + turbos > 2000 (I hope) Buick GTP (Mid-Engined Sports Car) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 02 Jun 1999 18:40:32 -0700 From: rr Subject: Re: (promedit) First, be warned, promedit can be finicky, if there's the slightest problem with the .ecu file, it can hang. But, I still like it and use it. So, to just look at a .bin, just type the command 'promedit' followed by the name of the .bin you wish to look at: promedit 747akal.bin Then, you will be prompted for a .ecu file, enter: SPK747 The '.ecu' part is assumed, and not entered on the prompt line. I can recommend the .ecu file: SPK747.ECU, (I'm biased, see the gmecm web site under 'member projects' or similar). I also use the older version of promedit, the one in 'incoming' called 'promedit.zip'. It will then complain about the cksum, just hit the 'enter' key. You can now hit the 'F2' key, and enter a value which is a table/map to observe. BobR. Don.F.Broadus@xxx.com wrote: > > I have tried to down load the 747 Bins into promedit but had zero luck. Is > there a procedure to copy a bin then load it into > promedit ? I do not have any experience with these programs. > Thanks for your help > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: steve ravet [SMTP:Steve.Ravet@xxx.com] > > Sent: Wednesday, June 02, 1999 9:45 AM > > To: diy_efi@xxx.edu > > Subject: Re: > > > > > > > > Geffro wrote: > > > > > > Hi folks > > > I've been searching the diy--efi website without much luck > > > Have read prog 101 but i dont understand any of it > > > eg > > > > > > The PROM has tables and some program code. It maps into processor space > > > from 0xd000 to 0xdfff. The ROM appears in the processor space from > > 0xe000 to > > > 0xffff. Data space in the PROM is from 0x000 to 0x616. Code starts at > > 0x617 > > > and continues to the end of the PROM, 0xfff. > > > > > > So to learn this where do i go ? > > > > Well, I hate to say it but read through the archives, searching for > > programming 101. Also read the tuning tips document which describes how > > it all works together. And pay attention to what comes across the gmecm > > list. > > > > Also download some of the 747 bins and run them through either promedit > > or tuna. That way you can actually see some of the tables, see how > > spark timing varies by load and rpm, etc. > > > > > I have collected a few proms that I'd like to read. > > > So can you good folk > > > tell me what I need > > > Is a prom reader an emulator and burner?cause i'd like to buy one > > > > A reader/programmer is different from an emulator. You need a > > reader/programmer, the emulator is nice but not necessary. > > > > --steve > > > > > whatever so i can start to work thiis out > > > Cheers > > > Geoff > > > > -- > > Steve Ravet > > steve.ravet@xxx.com > > Advanced Risc Machines, Inc. > > www.arm.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 2 Jun 1999 18:54:33 -0400 From: "Bruce Plecan" Subject: Re: Knock sensors Heck, they can pick up the fractured ribs in a serpentine belt. A poor Alternator bearing. Timing gears might give it KS a migrane, from all the noise. Next chance, I get I think I'm gonna try an op-amp, and comparator, and see what I get. In my experiments with the ESC Module KS, there were slight differences. From memory, was a max of like 4 degrees knock to 0 for a given engine. Bruce | Hi all, | I am adapting a 730 to a Mopar RB engine and I have some questions about | Knock sensors: | How sensitive are knock sensors to noise generated by gear drives? If | they are affected would selection solve the problem? ( for instance a | knock sensor off a factory supercharged engine) | What about noise from mechanical (roller cams)? | Bill Edgeworth ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 02 Jun 1999 17:36:00 -0500 From: dave.williams@xxx.us (Dave Williams) Subject: Re: Turbo'd s.b. chev...in a 69 Camaro? maybe? - -> what happens when an automatic transmission is in park, and Torsen is - -> named after Mr. Norberg Torsen who invented that special kind of - -> mechanism (he was Swedish). The Torsen was invented by Vernon Gleasman and originally built by the Gleason (note the difference in name) works. The name is an acronym built from "TORque SENsing". Conceptually the Gleasman-Torsen was similar to other worm-type differentials dating clear back to the early part of the century; Gleasman's primary contribution to the state of the art was the design of the machinery needed to cut the worms accurately and economically. If there was a Mr. Norberg Torsen, I've never heard of him. ==dave.williams@xxx.us====================================== I've got a secret / I've been hiding / under my skin / | Who are you? my heart is human / my blood is boiling / my brain IBM | who, who? =================================== http://home1.gte.net/42/index.htm ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 2 Jun 1999 16:33:50 -0700 (PDT) From: Jim Davies Subject: Re: Turbo'd s.b. chev...in a 69 Camaro? maybe? On Wed, 2 Jun 1999, Todd....!! wrote: > Is the Dana 60 considered a Sure Grip? Or just a posi? > > Don't know what to call it, now that I think about it, anybody? > Older 60s used an Eaton PowrLok [2 piece case] later ones used a Trac-Lok [one piece case, no ramps] Older 8 3/4s used a PowrLok. In 1968-9 they started using the Borg-Warner Spin-resistant [cone-type] Older [50s-60s] GMs used the Powr-Lok also Olds used the spin-resistant in the late 60s Ford 8 3/4-9-9 3/8 inch dropouts used a small, plate type LSD called an Equalock [aka Equapop] which, due to the small available diff size, was never used with 427s. The cars came with a 4 pinion open diff and a no-spin could be installed at the dealer or elsewhere. All of the above [except the no-spin] are limited slips, with a plethora of marketing names, like 'positraction' 'safe-t-track' 'sure-grip' etc etc. Just think of a conventional differential, with a bit of friction between each axle shaft and the diff case added. Breakaway torques are in the area of 30 to 250 ft lbs. Once you exceed the breakaway torque, they act like a conventional diff. The breakaway torque varies a lot between individual samples of identical units. The Powr-Lok has a 'feedback' capability making it more desireable, and more expensive to mfr. Obsolete. It was the best of the plate types, IMO. Oh, yeah. There is no more good posi lube available, complicating things. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 2 Jun 1999 16:37:08 -0700 (PDT) From: Jim Davies Subject: Re: Prowler V6 now ESB On Wed, 2 Jun 1999, Shannen Durphey wrote: > Never seen it, doesn't mean it's not so. Seems like different parts > of the country had different "standard parts" in the engines. Fer > example, lotsa 4 bolt 350s in MT, not so many in MA. > I have a cast 283 crank in my EFI'd 302. It's from a 67 though. > Funny stuff in 67, spin on filters, no internal vent canister, no > machining for crankcase vent tube, but only on some engines. I don't > know what the connection is, except maybe California emissions. > I've seen the notched 283 engines. I can identify the source of one > as a GMC truck. At one time I used to buy and sell lotsa SBCs. Just about the time I knew I had seen everything, along would come something new... ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 02 Jun 1999 19:46:46 -0400 From: "Peter D. Hipson" Subject: Re: Types of differentials/Traction aiding devices ARB's can only be used on surfaces with a low coefficient of friction. That is, off road, or drag racing. In either of these areas, who cares about mileage! Strong: well, we beat the hell out of them on trails, and they don't break very often. Most common problem is air leaks, etc. At 04:30 PM 6/2/99 -0700, you wrote: >Can ya do a W.O.T. launch with the button OFF, then turn it on in the >middle of the launch, under FULL TORQUE? > >Just how strong is this unit? > >AND, would a car with one of these air posi's get better gas mileage >with the posi OFF than it would with the air-posi on? > >Just wondrinnnnn......... > > >LATER! > >Todd....!! > > >Frederic Breitwieser wrote: >> >> > The type of posi is NOT dictated by the type of rear it's in or made for. There are limited slip, Torsen and locking differentials made for the Dana 60. If you want to know what type of unit is in the rear you'll have to actually look at it. >> >> And this is not a sarcastic response, either :) >> >> I'd highly recommend an ARB airlocker for this rear. direct bolt in, >> easy to control with a pushbutton, and totally open when needed. >> >> -- >> >> Frederic Breitwieser >> Bridgeport CT 06606 >> >> 1993 Supercharged Lincoln Continental >> 1989 HWMMV w/turbocharged 500cid Caddy >> 1975 Dodge D200 Club Cab soon to have 431 stroker + turbos >> 2000 (I hope) Buick GTP (Mid-Engined Sports Car) > > > Thanks, Peter Hipson (founder, NEHOG) 1995 White NA Hummer Wagon ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 02 Jun 1999 19:48:30 -0400 From: "Peter D. Hipson" Subject: Re: Prowler V6 Hummers are mixed metric and SAE. The engine and drivetrain are metric. Body/frame/fittings are mostly SAE. You *never* have the right socket on the rachet. At 04:28 PM 6/2/99 -0700, you wrote: >Hey Fred, > >Just wonderin, > >Is your Hummer mostly metric or SAE? > >AND will/is your 2000 Fred-mobile gonna be metric or sae or mostly >which? > >Just wonderinnnnnnn...... > >Todd....... > >----------- > >Frederic Breitwieser wrote: >> >> > And seeing as how most of freds rides are American built n all, I'd have >> > to say that he was REALLY only 3/4 serious... >> >> Are you kidding? The Lincoln uses more metric than SAE!!! The 75 >> Dodge truck is all SAE of course. >> >> -- >> >> Frederic Breitwieser >> Bridgeport CT 06606 >> >> 1993 Supercharged Lincoln Continental >> 1989 HWMMV w/turbocharged 500cid Caddy >> 1975 Dodge D200 Club Cab soon to have 431 stroker + turbos >> 2000 (I hope) Buick GTP (Mid-Engined Sports Car) > > > Thanks, Peter Hipson (founder, NEHOG) 1995 White NA Hummer Wagon ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 2 Jun 1999 18:57:39 -0500 From: "Dan Plaskett" Subject: Re: Prowler V6 I bought about a gross of those last week if anybody needs one let me know. Dan Plaskett - -----Original Message----- From: David A. Cooley To: diy_efi@xxx.edu> Date: Tuesday, June 01, 1999 11:33 AM Subject: Re: Prowler V6 >> So, if I understand correctly we'll need a metric magnet in order to >> tell whether our pistons are aluminum or not? > >Not just any metric magnet... A Left handed Unobtanium/niobium alloy metric >magnet. > > > ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 2 Jun 1999 20:01:16 -0400 From: "C. Brooks" Subject: Re: Types of differentials/Traction aiding devices That's a good question. I don't know but to put a little perspective on this... One of the club members has a Toyota truck with a mild 383, TH350 tranny, Dual Marlin crawler transfer case both with 4.7:1 gears, and Dana axles (60 rear, 44 front) with 5.?:1 gearing, and 36" swampers. I've seen him use (Abuse) this truck pretty hard. The final drive ratio in first gear low range is well over 200:1. That's ALOT of torque multiplication, and he's never had an ARB fail (YET!) Having the diff locked won't make any difference in mileage. Charles Brooks - -----Original Message----- From: Todd....!! To: diy_efi@xxx.edu> Date: Wednesday, June 02, 1999 8:20 PM Subject: Re: Types of differentials/Traction aiding devices >Can ya do a W.O.T. launch with the button OFF, then turn it on in the >middle of the launch, under FULL TORQUE? > >Just how strong is this unit? > >AND, would a car with one of these air posi's get better gas mileage >with the posi OFF than it would with the air-posi on? > >Just wondrinnnnn......... > > >LATER! > >Todd....!! > > >Frederic Breitwieser wrote: >> >> > The type of posi is NOT dictated by the type of rear it's in or made for. There are limited slip, Torsen and locking differentials made for the Dana 60. If you want to know what type of unit is in the rear you'll have to actually look at it. >> >> And this is not a sarcastic response, either :) >> >> I'd highly recommend an ARB airlocker for this rear. direct bolt in, >> easy to control with a pushbutton, and totally open when needed. >> >> -- >> >> Frederic Breitwieser >> Bridgeport CT 06606 >> >> 1993 Supercharged Lincoln Continental >> 1989 HWMMV w/turbocharged 500cid Caddy >> 1975 Dodge D200 Club Cab soon to have 431 stroker + turbos >> 2000 (I hope) Buick GTP (Mid-Engined Sports Car) > > ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 02 Jun 1999 20:08:47 -0400 From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Hélène?= Villemure Subject: Re: Injectors Lance, the injectors from a Toyota Supra (1987-92) should fit, 440 cc/min. Also the RX-7 turbo injectors are 550 cc/min.! Hope this helps, Helene At 22:33 99-05-31 -0400, you wrote: >Anyone have a reliable source for reasonably priced injectors. I am looking >for 32-35 lb. per Hr. low impedence type. Any info greatly appreciated. > >Lance > >New to list. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 02 Jun 1999 19:42:23 -0700 From: rr Subject: Re: 730 program Mike Pilkenton wrote: > > I have a 730 ecm variety from a 92 Camaro 3.1L V6. Does this ECM have > all the programming and tables located in the EEPROM (MEMCAL) or does it > contain some of the base program in ROM somewhere else on the PCB? > > I'm curious because I need to get it reprogrammed to remove the EGR, AC, > AIR, and VATS functions. > > Mike Pilkenton The 730 is all in the eprom. As for the A/C and AIR, no need to change them. The A/C pressure switch wire will need to be grounded, otherwise the cooling fan will run. Without A/C, you don't need the P/S press switch either, leave the circuit open (closes with high press). The VATS can be done with an simple external circuit, or as a bit in the code. The EGR will need to be changed. The EGR is also used to test the MAP. So you might need to disable some of the MAP tests (by err code), to prevent map errors. There's two other things you might need to know: when going through the code, it appears that the order of tables in memory are the reverse of the layout in the v8 730's. after any battery disconnect, this ecm/engine combo needs to go through an idle learn session like you won't believe. otherwise it takes about two weeks of daily driving for it to finally idle, that is without stalling, lurching, rev-ing up, and otherwise being difficult to drive. BobR. - -- ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 02 Jun 1999 19:22:18 -0700 From: rr Subject: Re: Turbo'd s.b. chev...in a 69 Camaro? maybe? My daily driver has a lock-rite in it, you can't imagine how many folks have tried to 'help-out', with all that racket. I was outa' the car, half-way across the lot, and one guy was still pullin on the centers and shaken the tire/wheels, looking for what was wrong... yea, I finally went back and clued him in. BobR. .. wrote: > > Or you could have had fun with one of the earlier "Detroit Lockers" that had > a mechanical ratchet mechanism that would make a loud ratcheting noise every > time you turned a corner. It made for a car that was a real "head turner" > from the pedestrians - loud clanking and ratcheting noises. > rap > > "Todd....!!" wrote: > > > Jim, > > > > I'm now mostly a Mopar man, and have a Dana 60 which has a FULL POSI > > most of the time, the posi only 'breaks' when doing a slow tight turn... > > sometimes you can actually hear the clutches 'break'/slip during this > > procedure... > > > > Whereas the Chev type limited slips are only posi's when ya need it, > > i.e. under high load and such... > > > > In comes that GN that was spinnin only ONE tire around the turns (the > > lighter weighted tire, i.e. inside turn tire) when the boost came > > in...(He spun out several times due to the need to spin in order to even > > come close to qualifying for further runs...needless to say, he didn't > > make the cut) > > > > Then ya have the 8 3/4 auburn locker, that has no clutches, just some > > sorta cone thing... never really looked at one, buddy jsut bought a > > brand spankin new auburn for his 8 3/4 when he swapped his 4.10's out > > for 3.23's! it seems to work pretty good, he's only pushin about a > > stock 383 in his 70 Bee, so there's not much power to tell, ya know... > > > > LATER! > > > > Todd.... > > http://www.c-com.net/~atc347/toddlnk.htm > > > > Jim Davies wrote: > > > > > > On Tue, 1 Jun 1999, Todd....!! wrote: > > > > > > > I thought all GN's were posi's, this one musta been a limited slip or > > > > somethin... > > > > > > > I'll bite...whats the difference? ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 02 Jun 1999 20:24:50 -0700 From: rr Subject: Re: Injectors Todd....!! wrote: > > Hey BobR! > > Thanks for that link man! welcome > > A penny saved is a penny earned, right? Yep, only have so much to spend, so you/I have to pick and choose.. > > I dunno about rebuilt injectors though! 're-conditioned', Linder gets upset when they are called rebuilt > > Are they as reliable and accurate as the new one's? Don't know. > > I may have to experience this for myself, especially if the rebuilt > injectors are about half the cost of the new one's! > > Have pulled up the site, looks great... > > Wonder if they have warranties on their injectors? > > LATER! > > Thanks again! > > Todd.... > > --------- > > rr wrote: > > > > Try these guys: > > > > Linder Technical Services (317-487-1868 or www.lindertech.com) > > > > If I remember correctly, he also sells re-conditioned injectors > > at a good price. > > > > BobR. > > > > AzDatsun@xxx.com wrote: > > > > > > Anyone have a reliable source for reasonably priced injectors. I am looking > > > for 32-35 lb. per Hr. low impedence type. Any info greatly appreciated. > > > > > > Lance > > > > > > New to list. ------------------------------ End of DIY_EFI Digest V4 #328 ***************************** To subscribe to DIY_EFI-Digest, send the command: subscribe diy_efi-digest in the body of a message to "Majordomo@xxx. A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to subscribe to that instead, replace "diy_efi-digest" in the command above with "diy_efi".