DIY_EFI Digest Thursday, March 9 2000 Volume 05 : Number 095 In this issue: Re: Turbo speed sensor - ferrite in comp wheel ? Re: Turbo speed sensor - ferrite in comp wheel ? Re: Turbo speed sensor - ferrite in comp wheel ? Administrivia Re: Turbo speed sensor - ferrite in comp wheel ? OEM EFI adaptation Re: Turbo speed sensor - ferrite in comp wheel ? Re: Electronic Transmission Control Re: AFM measurement/backpressure (was Turbo speed sensor) Re: Electronic Transmission Control Re: Electronic Transmission Control Signal generator for ecm bench See the end of the digest for information on subscribing to the DIY_EFI or DIY_EFI-Digest mailing lists. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 09 Mar 2000 16:46:59 From: "Mike (Perth, Western Australia)" Subject: Re: Turbo speed sensor - ferrite in comp wheel ? At 04:37 PM 9/03/2000 +0200, Nic van der Walt wrote: >> I really would like to do a turbo speed sensor - so far no reply from >> the emails I've sent out to distributors - not even a "we don't do it" :( > >What could work for a turbo speed sensor is strapping a microphone to it >and listening to the frequency it screams at. A wideband knock sensor would >work well. On my bike I can clearly hear the turbo sweeping through the >frequencies as it speeds up. mmm Hadn't thought of that - I suppose a cal check with an optical tacho would be the thing, since I've noticed the note changes with the length of inlet pipe and even type of air filter... More I think about it - I'll go for a very small hole in the edge of the comp wheel - keep the aluminium swarf, weigh up a small ferrite bead and glue/wedge/solder this in to the hole. Hopefully the 0.05g difference won't radically upset my comp balance. With that setup and a fast reluctance pickup I should be able to get precise indication of speed. Will be an interesting exercise. Any comments on the best means to attach a ferrite bead into the edge of the comp wheel and not have it fall out at 150K rpm ? ? Rgds ~`:o) Mike Massen Trading as "Network Power Systems" and "Network Computers" Perth, Western Australia Ph +61 8 9444 8961 Fx +618 9264 8229 (fax -> email) Products/Personal/Client web area at http://www.wantree.com.au/~erazmus (Current pics - trip to Malaysia to install equipment in jungle power site) Some say there is no magic but, all things begin with thought then it becomes academic, then some poor slob works out a practical way to implement all that theory, this is called Engineering - for most people another form of magic. - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe from diy_efi, send "unsubscribe diy_efi" (without the quotes) in the body of a message (not the subject) to majordomo@xxx.org ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 9 Mar 2000 09:35:31 +0100 From: "Espen Hilde" Subject: Re: Turbo speed sensor - ferrite in comp wheel ? Hi! What obout drilling 2 holes in opposite side ,then the balance is ok and use a light and optical reader trou the holes. Espen > >> I really would like to do a turbo speed sensor - so far no reply from > >> the emails I've sent out to distributors - not even a "we don't do it" :( > > > >What could work for a turbo speed sensor is strapping a microphone to it > >and listening to the frequency it screams at. A wideband knock sensor would > >work well. On my bike I can clearly hear the turbo sweeping through the > >frequencies as it speeds up. > > mmm Hadn't thought of that - I suppose a cal check with an optical tacho > would be the thing, since I've noticed the note changes with the length > of inlet pipe and even type of air filter... > > More I think about it - I'll go for a very small hole in the edge of the > comp wheel - keep the aluminium swarf, weigh up a small ferrite bead and > glue/wedge/solder this in to the hole. Hopefully the 0.05g difference > won't radically upset my comp balance. With that setup and a fast > reluctance pickup I should be able to get precise indication of speed. > Will be an interesting exercise. > > Any comments on the best means to attach a ferrite bead into the edge > of the comp wheel and not have it fall out at 150K rpm ? > > > > ? > > > > Rgds ~`:o) > > Mike Massen Trading as "Network Power Systems" and "Network Computers" > Perth, Western Australia Ph +61 8 9444 8961 Fx +618 9264 8229 (fax -> email) > Products/Personal/Client web area at http://www.wantree.com.au/~erazmus > (Current pics - trip to Malaysia to install equipment in jungle power site) > > Some say there is no magic but, all things begin with thought then it becomes > academic, then some poor slob works out a practical way to implement all that > theory, this is called Engineering - for most people another form of magic. > > - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from diy_efi, send "unsubscribe diy_efi" (without the quotes) > in the body of a message (not the subject) to majordomo@xxx.org - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe from diy_efi, send "unsubscribe diy_efi" (without the quotes) in the body of a message (not the subject) to majordomo@xxx.org ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 09 Mar 2000 17:13:53 From: "Mike (Perth, Western Australia)" Subject: Re: Turbo speed sensor - ferrite in comp wheel ? At 09:35 AM 9/03/2000 +0100, "Espen Hilde" wrote: >What obout drilling 2 holes in opposite side ,then the balance is ok >and use a light and optical reader trou the holes. hehe - You mean a small hole striaght through the center hub of the comp wheel - would do wonders for stress me thinks Ah - come to think of it - I could use one of those cheap laser pointers and shine it at an angle across the edghe of the blades - and just need a optical pickup at the opposite side... Beauty - hand't thought of that until your email prompted me to take a fresh look see - Tah :O) Would mean a bit of machining the comp wheel cover - but heck thats far better then messing with the balance.. Yep - thats what I'll try - therefore NOP - I will *not* drill a hole in comp wheel - - no more dreams about ally shattering through the engine :) Actually would look neat - splaying red light inside the pipe, would make a nice mpeg - must get my FD-81 Sony mavica soon Had one in Malaysia, brilliant to store pis on floppy... Rgds Mike Massen Ancient Sufi saying: "Should your God save you from adversity, choose another God" Pictures of site installation at Mendulong near Sipitang, Sabah (Malaysia) for container based RAPS... http://www.wantree.com.au/~erazmus Vehicle modifications on GMH Turbo, twin tyres, possible 175Kw at wheels Preliminary pictures at http://www.wantree.com.au/~erazmus/Twin_tyre_vehicle/ My editorial on twin-tyre opinion and good reference about tyres:- http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/2195/ttyreopinion.html - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe from diy_efi, send "unsubscribe diy_efi" (without the quotes) in the body of a message (not the subject) to majordomo@xxx.org ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 9 Mar 2000 01:00:40 -0800 (PST) From: Orin Subject: Administrivia First, when replying to messages, PLEASE delete the annoying message at the end about how to unsubscribe. One copy is bad enough and more don't seem to help... I still get requests going to the wrong place. Out of order/delayed messages. The outgoing mail queue got a bit constipated over the last few days, so you might have received messages out of order or delayed. It's looking good now though. Orin. - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe from diy_efi, send "unsubscribe diy_efi" (without the quotes) in the body of a message (not the subject) to majordomo@xxx.org ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 9 Mar 2000 10:24:04 +0100 From: "Espen Hilde" Subject: Re: Turbo speed sensor - ferrite in comp wheel ? Hi again... No...... Take the compleate turbocharger and fix the wheel so it stands still. Drill trou the cower so you hit near the outer edge of the compressor wheel, turn the wheel 180 deg. drill trou the wheel once more to have the balance fixed.Or offset the hole closer to senter if you dont want 2 pulses for each rpm.Glu the optical sensor in the back hole and your laser on front cower.Maybe you have to clean the sensor once in a while.... Espen - ---------- > From: Mike (Perth, Western Australia) > To: diy_efi@xxx.org > Subject: Re: Turbo speed sensor - ferrite in comp wheel ? > Date: 9. mars 2000 18:13 > > At 09:35 AM 9/03/2000 +0100, "Espen Hilde" wrote: > >What obout drilling 2 holes in opposite side ,then the balance is ok > >and use a light and optical reader trou the holes. > > hehe - You mean a small hole striaght through the center hub of the > comp wheel - would do wonders for stress me thinks > > Ah - come to think of it - I could use one of those cheap laser pointers > and shine it at an angle across the edghe of the blades - and just need a > optical pickup at the opposite side... Beauty - hand't thought of that > until your email prompted me to take a fresh look see - Tah :O) > > Would mean a bit of machining the comp wheel cover - but heck thats far > better then messing with the balance.. > > Yep - thats what I'll try - therefore NOP - I will *not* drill a hole in > comp wheel - - no more dreams about ally shattering through > the engine :) > > Actually would look neat - splaying red light inside the pipe, would make > a nice mpeg - must get my FD-81 Sony mavica soon Had one in Malaysia, > brilliant to store pis on floppy... > > > > > Rgds > > > Mike Massen > > Ancient Sufi saying: > "Should your God save you from adversity, choose another God" > > Pictures of site installation at Mendulong near Sipitang, Sabah (Malaysia) for > container based RAPS... http://www.wantree.com.au/~erazmus > > Vehicle modifications on GMH Turbo, twin tyres, possible 175Kw at wheels > Preliminary pictures at http://www.wantree.com.au/~erazmus/Twin_tyre_vehicle/ > > My editorial on twin-tyre opinion and good reference about tyres:- > http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/2195/ttyreopinion.html > > - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from diy_efi, send "unsubscribe diy_efi" (without the quotes) > in the body of a message (not the subject) to majordomo@xxx.org - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe from diy_efi, send "unsubscribe diy_efi" (without the quotes) in the body of a message (not the subject) to majordomo@xxx.org ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 9 Mar 2000 21:19:16 +1000 From: "Geoff, Kate & Theo Campbell" Subject: OEM EFI adaptation Please forgive my innocence, but is this mailing list always this busy? I logged on to get my usual mail and was bombarded by over ninety messages. I don't wish to seem misplaced, I am actually an Autoelectrician who wishes to adapt a GM OEM EFI system (Holden Camira 1.8 MPFI, no O2 sensor) to a Ford Escort 2Lt, and I was hoping for some information to make life a bit easier. I am well aware of the possibilities of coolant temp sensor voltage manipulation, as well as other small tweaks, but my main problem is the doing away with the flap type air flow meter. I have a later Camira's map sensor. I would like to hear some ideas on this, but keep in mind it is for a rally car, and does not need to be totally pollution free. Thanx. - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe from diy_efi, send "unsubscribe diy_efi" (without the quotes) in the body of a message (not the subject) to majordomo@xxx.org ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 9 Mar 2000 06:23:27 -0500 From: "nacelp" Subject: Re: Turbo speed sensor - ferrite in comp wheel ? Have you successfully done this drill thru the wheel, idea?. Grumpy > Hi again... > No...... > Take the compleate turbocharger and fix the wheel so it stands still. > Drill trou the cower so you hit near the outer edge of the compressor > wheel, turn the wheel 180 deg. drill trou the wheel once more to have the > balance fixed.Or offset the hole closer to senter if you dont want 2 pulses > > for each rpm.Glu the optical sensor in the back hole and your laser on > front cower.Maybe you have to clean the sensor once in a while.... > Espen > > ---------- > > From: Mike (Perth, Western Australia) > > To: diy_efi@xxx.org > > Subject: Re: Turbo speed sensor - ferrite in comp wheel ? > > Date: 9. mars 2000 18:13 > > > > At 09:35 AM 9/03/2000 +0100, "Espen Hilde" wrote: > > >What obout drilling 2 holes in opposite side ,then the balance is ok > > >and use a light and optical reader trou the holes. > > > > hehe - You mean a small hole striaght through the center hub of the > > comp wheel - would do wonders for stress me thinks > > > > Ah - come to think of it - I could use one of those cheap laser pointers > > and shine it at an angle across the edghe of the blades - and just need a > > optical pickup at the opposite side... Beauty - hand't thought of that > > until your email prompted me to take a fresh look see - Tah :O) > > > > Would mean a bit of machining the comp wheel cover - but heck thats far > > better then messing with the balance.. > > > > Yep - thats what I'll try - therefore NOP - I will *not* drill a hole in > > comp wheel - - no more dreams about ally shattering through > > the engine :) > > > > Actually would look neat - splaying red light inside the pipe, would make > > a nice mpeg - must get my FD-81 Sony mavica soon Had one in > Malaysia, > > brilliant to store pis on floppy... > > > > > > > > > > Rgds > > > > > > Mike Massen > > > > Ancient Sufi saying: > > "Should your God save you from adversity, choose another God" > > > > Pictures of site installation at Mendulong near Sipitang, Sabah > (Malaysia) for > > container based RAPS... http://www.wantree.com.au/~erazmus > > > > Vehicle modifications on GMH Turbo, twin tyres, possible 175Kw at wheels > > Preliminary pictures at > http://www.wantree.com.au/~erazmus/Twin_tyre_vehicle/ > > > > My editorial on twin-tyre opinion and good reference about tyres:- > > http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/2195/ttyreopinion.html > > > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- - -- > > > To unsubscribe from diy_efi, send "unsubscribe diy_efi" (without the > quotes) > > in the body of a message (not the subject) to majordomo@xxx.org > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- - -- > To unsubscribe from diy_efi, send "unsubscribe diy_efi" (without the quotes) > in the body of a message (not the subject) to majordomo@xxx.org > - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe from diy_efi, send "unsubscribe diy_efi" (without the quotes) in the body of a message (not the subject) to majordomo@xxx.org ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 9 Mar 2000 06:29:57 -0500 From: "nacelp" Subject: Re: Electronic Transmission Control > Many...any HP F-Car or Vette can be "easily" tuned > (heads...headers...cam...calibration) to run mid to high 12's...some folks > have even gotten those heavy Impala SS's into the 12's...S-10 V8 conversions too... With this I rest, Changing heads, headers, cam and calibration is not my idea of easily tuned (or cheap). Grumpy - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe from diy_efi, send "unsubscribe diy_efi" (without the quotes) in the body of a message (not the subject) to majordomo@xxx.org ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 09 Mar 2000 05:40:46 -0600 From: Tom Sharpe Subject: Re: AFM measurement/backpressure (was Turbo speed sensor) "Mike (Perth, Western Australia)" wrote: > >> Regardless of the practical need/outcome - I'd still be interested to > >> see what sort of revs the damn thing actually does > > > >60K to 120K rpm > > Is it possible to measure turbo speed with vibration - (sound?) just a brain > F~~~. > > > >Processor speed ain't an issue. > > Well I think it is - for a reliable realtime o/s and scheduler its helpful > to have lots of grunt - given the typical overhead a really good o/s > introduces into the overall responsiveness. With a faster processor there > are so many more exception conditions you can operate on in dynamic > conditions. Sure lazy AFM to injector translation with correction from > engine temp etc doesn't need a 10Mhz cpu - a simple 1Mhz 68705R3 will > do nicely - but once you start adding high speed sensors or at least > expect to provide cleverer filtering algorithms - such as kalman filters > and all the related conditions then the faster the processor the reduced > chance you have of a scheduling bind at really high rpms. > I kind of agree, but I rather see several small/fast processors (pics?) handling those "extra" functions, ie. sampling and filtering each sensor (or pair), producing a set of outputs for the main processor to use. provides easier programming and lots of power with cheap/slow components. Tom - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe from diy_efi, send "unsubscribe diy_efi" (without the quotes) in the body of a message (not the subject) to majordomo@xxx.org ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 09 Mar 2000 06:43:39 -0500 From: Shannen Durphey Subject: Re: Electronic Transmission Control Isn't this getting a bit off topic? Shannen MysticZ wrote: > > nacelp wrote: > > > > > The low 1st of the 700R4 and 4L60E are one of the strong points! > > > > Ha, maybe in your opinion, but never in mine. > > They designed that feature for the slug 305s that had trouble getting out of > > their own way. > > It also, allows em to run a slopey, or forgiving calibration, (you're pick) > > since the engine sees so little load with all that gear multiplication to > > get the mass moving. > > I can spin any tire short of ET Streets at wide open throttle on the > strip with my lowly 400 foot pounds of torque and 2.73 gears. My > thoughts are to get the stickiest tires on the planet, gear it as low as > possible without spinning, stage, floor it, hold on tight! I've been up > to 140 before and still had room to accelerate and 75 mph is 1900 rpm in > 4th. 1st is a *little* low since I'd like to be at about 2100 rpm at 75 > mph for better cruise mileage, but I'm not going to screw with it to get > 200 rpm. I'll just drive faster ;) > -- > Steve > 97 Chevy Camaro Z28, Mystic teal, A4, not stock > 90 Kawasaki EX500A4, black, M6, not even CLOSE to stock! > lt1_z28@xxx.net/~lt1_z28 > Aluminum, steel, carbon fiber, titanium, and two cast iron balls. > McMillan Motorsports- http://www.mmsbikes.com > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from diy_efi, send "unsubscribe diy_efi" (without the quotes) > in the body of a message (not the subject) to majordomo@xxx.org - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe from diy_efi, send "unsubscribe diy_efi" (without the quotes) in the body of a message (not the subject) to majordomo@xxx.org ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 09 Mar 2000 07:04:50 -0500 From: Shannen Durphey Subject: Re: Electronic Transmission Control Doug Dayson wrote: > > The initial model year(s) were designed for the blazingly powerful 200hp > Cross-Fire 350's...700's were continually updated until mid 88...the latest > version can be identified by a lack of pressure ports on the case...don't > mistake the V8 700's (Chevy Bellhousing Only) with the 6-cyl version > (Universal Bellhousing)... No 700R4 will bolt to BOP pattern. Universal bell is CBOP. > > Ya, right, but with a little tuning run 12s, and the trannies last in stock > > form. How many easily tunable 12 sec applications were the 700s used > > in?...... > > Many...any HP F-Car or Vette can be "easily" tuned I turn wrenches in a Vette shop, and a few guys on the list own them. Be careful about your claims. > (heads...headers...cam...calibration) to run mid to high 12's...some folks > have even gotten those heavy Impala SS's into the 12's...S-10 V8 conversions too... > > And how about the GMC Cyclone...that turbo Blazer thingie..."probably" a AWD > 700R4 (it has a different case to mount to the AWD transfer case) in it eh... Same case, different output shaft. > > > Important Note:...the 700R4 runs hot (not sure about the 2004R...it probably > does too)...if any severe duty (racing...towing etc) is forseen use a > aftermarket external cooler in series after the radiator cooler... For cars that see cool weather, the aftermarket cooler should be first. Cold ATF is not good for the trans either. Shannen - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe from diy_efi, send "unsubscribe diy_efi" (without the quotes) in the body of a message (not the subject) to majordomo@xxx.org ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 09 Mar 2000 07:48:42 -0500 From: Scott Knight Subject: Signal generator for ecm bench Now that I am working on an ecm bench to test a few things with regard to running two controllers in parallel (LT1 PCM and SEFI8LO), I need a function generator to give me things like crank and vss signals. After a couple hours in the message archives I decided to make a run to Radio Shack to find a book to get the 555 Timer IC Circuits book. This looks to have the circuit(s) I need to build, but wouldn't you know, all of the stores in my district don't have it (this is what the local store manager told me after searching her computer). So, instead of driving all over the west end of PA to get a $2 book, I wonder if anyone has a schematic that would be useful to me instead. Being an ME, I have limited EE capabilities, but at least can read schematics fairly well. Building is not a problem...designing and understanding are. Thanks. - -- Scott Knight mailto:scott@xxx.com http://www.scottknight.com/ IRC:SS396man '95 Black Impala SS '94 Ducati 900SS CR - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe from diy_efi, send "unsubscribe diy_efi" (without the quotes) in the body of a message (not the subject) to majordomo@xxx.org ------------------------------ End of DIY_EFI Digest V5 #95 **************************** To subscribe to DIY_EFI-Digest, send the command: subscribe diy_efi-digest in the body of a message to "Majordomo@xxx. A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to subscribe to that instead, replace "diy_efi-digest" in the command above with "diy_efi".