DIY_EFI Digest Friday, March 31 2000 Volume 05 : Number 132 In this issue: RE: Looking for pulse output MAF Re: Looking for pulse output MAF Re: Looking for pulse output MAF Re: Looking for pulse output MAF Re: Looking for pulse output MAF data logger files - software to read them Re: data logger files - software to read them Wide ratio O2 sensors Re: data logger files - software to read them Affordable Wideband ECUs - How to? Re: Affordable Wideband ECUs - How to? Re: Affordable Wideband ECUs - How to? Re: Affordable Wideband ECUs - How to? Re: DIY_EFI Digest V5 #131 Re: Affordable Wideband ECUs - How to? Re: Affordable Wideband ECUs - How to? Re: Affordable Wideband ECUs - How to? Re: Affordable Wideband ECUs - How to? See the end of the digest for information on subscribing to the DIY_EFI or DIY_EFI-Digest mailing lists. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 31 Mar 2000 07:56:01 -0700 From: bearbvd@xxx.net (Greg Hermann) Subject: RE: Looking for pulse output MAF >Hi Grumpy, > I thought the "standard" was 1.3hp for each gram per second?????I could >be wrong..... >-Carl Summers > Yep--it's 1.3 cfm per HP and 1.3 HP/ gps. Greg - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe from diy_efi, send "unsubscribe diy_efi" (without the quotes) in the body of a message (not the subject) to majordomo@xxx.org ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 31 Mar 2000 10:00:34 -0500 From: "nacelp" Subject: Re: Looking for pulse output MAF I posted later correcting that. Hey Greg, ya sure about that grams/second??.. I have .75 g/s per HP Bruce > >Hi Grumpy, > > I thought the "standard" was 1.3hp for each gram per second?????I could > >be wrong..... > >-Carl Summers > > > Yep--it's 1.3 cfm per HP and 1.3 HP/ gps. > > Greg > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- - -- > To unsubscribe from diy_efi, send "unsubscribe diy_efi" (without the quotes) > in the body of a message (not the subject) to majordomo@xxx.org > - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe from diy_efi, send "unsubscribe diy_efi" (without the quotes) in the body of a message (not the subject) to majordomo@xxx.org ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 31 Mar 2000 08:23:15 -0700 From: bearbvd@xxx.net (Greg Hermann) Subject: Re: Looking for pulse output MAF >I posted later correcting that. > >Hey Greg, >ya sure about that grams/second??.. I have .75 g/s per HP >Bruce .75 g/s per HP is right. reciprocal of .75 is 1.333. :-) Greg > > >> >Hi Grumpy, >> > I thought the "standard" was 1.3hp for each gram per second?????I >could >> >be wrong..... >> >-Carl Summers >> > >> Yep--it's 1.3 cfm per HP and 1.3 HP/ gps. >> >> Greg - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe from diy_efi, send "unsubscribe diy_efi" (without the quotes) in the body of a message (not the subject) to majordomo@xxx.org ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 31 Mar 2000 10:29:11 -0500 From: "nacelp" Subject: Re: Looking for pulse output MAF *#))$&#(ing MATH, #($*$&#)(@(ing MATH Grumpy Percocet and thinking don't mix > >I posted later correcting that. > > > >Hey Greg, > >ya sure about that grams/second??.. I have .75 g/s per HP > >Bruce > > .75 g/s per HP is right. reciprocal of .75 is 1.333. :-) > > Greg > > > > > >> >Hi Grumpy, > >> > I thought the "standard" was 1.3hp for each gram per second?????I > >could > >> >be wrong..... > >> >-Carl Summers > >> > > >> Yep--it's 1.3 cfm per HP and 1.3 HP/ gps. > >> > >> Greg > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- - -- > To unsubscribe from diy_efi, send "unsubscribe diy_efi" (without the quotes) > in the body of a message (not the subject) to majordomo@xxx.org > - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe from diy_efi, send "unsubscribe diy_efi" (without the quotes) in the body of a message (not the subject) to majordomo@xxx.org ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 31 Mar 2000 08:52:36 -0700 From: "Programmer" Subject: Re: Looking for pulse output MAF Wouldn't one from a 3.8 L V6 work ?? Should sure be close to the same calibrated flow... Lyndon. - -----Original Message----- From: Brian Franchuk To: diy_efi@xxx.org> Date: March 28, 2000 7:51 PM Subject: Looking for pulse output MAF Hi, I'm looking for a GM MAF (pulse output) that can handle the flow from a 4.0 liter motor (approx 220hp). I've already built the pulse to AFM conversion box so I need to use a pulsed sensor. The sensor I've got now (I got it from the U-pull-R yard out of a 2.8l chevy) can't handle the flow rate. Any help is appreciated. Brian - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe from diy_efi, send "unsubscribe diy_efi" (without the quotes) in the body of a message (not the subject) to majordomo@xxx.org - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe from diy_efi, send "unsubscribe diy_efi" (without the quotes) in the body of a message (not the subject) to majordomo@xxx.org ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 31 Mar 2000 08:38:54 -0600 From: "alexpeper" Subject: data logger files - software to read them If car 96+ OBD2 I will look at. If in SAE Jxxxx format will be able to decode. A problem with GM is there encryption is to make different models and years have different values of data for the same message. I can also provide a OBD2 vehicle simulator to obtain data and determine scaling. Alex Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 17:38:19 -0500 From: "Jason R. Haines" Subject: data logger files - software to read them I have some data files from an OE data logger (GM Tech 2). I am trying to see if it would be possible to read them with any other software. Anyone have any good ideas on what software I should try or any companies (or people) I might try sending a sample file to for them to figure out the data storage method? Regards, Jason - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe from diy_efi, send "unsubscribe diy_efi" (without the quotes) in the body of a message (not the subject) to majordomo@xxx.org ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 31 Mar 2000 09:56:50 -0600 (CST) From: Roger Heflin Subject: Re: data logger files - software to read them On Fri, 31 Mar 2000, alexpeper wrote: > If car 96+ OBD2 I will look at. If in SAE Jxxxx format will be able to > decode. > A problem with GM is there encryption is to make different models > and years have different values of data for the same message. I can also > provide a OBD2 vehicle simulator to obtain data and determine scaling. > Alex > The GM data encoding is not in any way shape or form and encryption. It is simply a encoding of what data bits are what. Encryption denotes someone attempting to make the data hard to deal with, I don't believe they did that, I believe the just encoded the data the easiest and quickest way. Their scalings are based on what ranges the sensors have and how many bits they have to encode the data in. THey also have limited space for the error flags, so to make the messages all be the same, they would need to have more bytes in the data stream (alot of which are unused) and would have less frames per second. Roger - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe from diy_efi, send "unsubscribe diy_efi" (without the quotes) in the body of a message (not the subject) to majordomo@xxx.org ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 31 Mar 2000 11:15:14 -0500 From: Will McGonegal Subject: Wide ratio O2 sensors >------------------------------ >Date: Tue, 28 Mar 2000 20:01:31 -0800 >From: garwillis@xxx.com (Garfield Willis) >Subject: Re: O2 sensor response times- catalyst >Argh. All I'm at liberty to say to the immediately above is "BZZZT". >Remember I warned ya, these devices are both spendy and VERY easy to >destroy by over-pumping or mis-pumping (pumping in the wrong direction). . . . . >I won't be saying too much more about tech stuff concerning these >sensors; as an instrument vendor I'm just not able to participate the >way I'd like to, without raising suspicions of bias. C'est le vie. Just >caveat your emptors, doods, and save at least one good, pristine, >virgin, unmangled sensor for EGOR, will ya? >TTFN, >Gar I can appreciate your reluctance to respond about the nitty gritty details of how these devices are to be used. I am eagerly waiting to find out what your product will be. For now we'll hook our sensors up to the NTK box at work so we don't fry them. We were using the wide ratio O2 sensor yesterday on a vehicle with a programmable FI computer. The car was on one of our chassis dynamometers. I set up the dyno controller software to hold the dyno at steady speeds for the testing. The throttle setting could be varied and the dyno would hold the speed constant. The air-fuel-ratio was read off the NTK system and adjustments to the fuel injection computer were made to get desired AFR. It really worked well. You could see the AFR reading quickly respond as the FI settings were changed. Handy tools to have. Will - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe from diy_efi, send "unsubscribe diy_efi" (without the quotes) in the body of a message (not the subject) to majordomo@xxx.org ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 31 Mar 2000 13:21:44 -0500 From: "Jason R. Haines" Subject: Re: data logger files - software to read them This is a multi-part message in MIME format. - ------=_NextPart_000_00AA_01BF9B14.0F746240 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Alex, Thanks for the offer to help. I have attached a PKZIP file with two data files - both from 1996 and newer vehicles. One is using the older GM software to store the data (*.ssf file) and the other is using the newer GM software to store the data (*.sur file). Both of these recordings are from a Tech 2. Please don't distribute these files to the mailing list. Thanks again, Jason - ----- Original Message ----- From: "alexpeper" To: Sent: Friday, March 31, 2000 9:38 AM Subject: data logger files - software to read them > If car 96+ OBD2 I will look at. If in SAE Jxxxx format will be able to > decode. > A problem with GM is there encryption is to make different models > and years have different values of data for the same message. I can also > provide a OBD2 vehicle simulator to obtain data and determine scaling. > Alex > > Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 17:38:19 -0500 > From: "Jason R. Haines" > Subject: data logger files - software to read them > > I have some data files from an OE data logger (GM Tech 2). I am trying to > see if it would be possible to read them with any other software. Anyone > have any good ideas on what software I should try or any companies (or > people) I might try sending a sample file to for them to figure out the data > storage method? > > Regards, > > Jason > > > > > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- - -- > To unsubscribe from diy_efi, send "unsubscribe diy_efi" (without the quotes) > in the body of a message (not the subject) to majordomo@xxx.org > > - ------=_NextPart_000_00AA_01BF9B14.0F746240 Content-Type: application/x-zip-compressed; name="10000002.zip" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="10000002.zip" UEsDBBQAAAAIAFJqfygv0agpzgwAALhCAAAMAAAAMTAwMDAwMDguU1VS7ZsNdBTFHcD/d5uYDxJI AgQIoiOKBCQJCWkMpam5XBKIhOSaOwMIT9gmy+XIfbF7FwifJyKgUYn4FYM8sRUf6NMiT4HSKipV sVoe1o9aP/ostr6Wx1NrfZXW2u1/dmaTzWXz8V7pMzmYd7/9787O7c789z8z/9md+fz5J/9gAQCd eGSScCohIXkETKgJyKEmYvNJsqdB9JPaoCSLIU/Ar6RW+N0ev0TKxZBI8hOzXdNI/uzZRWApS3WI 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[I tweaked the subject in a blatant attempt to seque to a related topic]. On Fri, 31 Mar 2000 11:15:14 -0500, Will McGonegal wrote: > I am eagerly waiting to find out what your >product will be. For now we'll hook our sensors up to the NTK box at work so we >don't fry them. Ahh, I was unsure until now whether you had their interface box as well as their sensor. Watching the behavior of those NTK ($600) sensors whilst under control by their own blue box is a perfectly safe way to learn more about them. Just that you'll have to be cutting into some of the leads/harness to measure currents. Others in your team may not appreciate that, but hey, that's science. :) >We were using the wide ratio O2 sensor yesterday on a vehicle with a >programmable FI computer. The car was on one of our chassis dynamometers. I >set up the dyno controller software to hold the dyno at steady speeds for the >testing. The throttle setting could be varied and the dyno would hold the speed >constant. The air-fuel-ratio was read off the NTK system and adjustments to the >fuel injection computer were made to get desired AFR. It really worked well. >You could see the AFR reading quickly respond as the FI settings were changed. >Handy tools to have. I expect you must have been holding significant load on the engine via the dyno, in order to get it into open-loop. This is the normal tuning mode for non-wideband controllers. What might be an interesting and fruitful thread to engage in, one that we can all share in without product hangups, is to think about the "next step", working out & discussing how one can affordably get to the point of using the wideband O2 sensor in *closed-loop* at significant load (or what is often referred to as WOT closed-loop). There was some discussion early on, and then later some also in private amongst a couple of us, about the possibility of programming an OEM controller like the GM ECUs to force it to stay in closed-loop even at high TPS and load, and trick the controller by mimicing the stoich-crossing to occur at whatever AFR you chose. This was essentially the idea of simulating the stoich-crossing input to the OEM controller, and use an EGOR module (or an NTK box, or whatever) to allow "moving" this simulated stoich-crossing to whatever AFR you commanded. Bruce Plecan and some of his GN/GM buddies apparently looked into it, and decided there likely wasn't enough "authority" in the tables that could be reprogrammed, to keep the controller forced into closed-loop, and gave the idea a miss, suggesting that you really needed to get at the code to do it right. But coaxing those extremely affordable OEM controllers to make the transition to WOT closed-loop controllers sure sounds like a wholesome grail worth somemore pursuit, purely from an economics standpoint. Of course, this also raises the corollary question of what additional coding algorithms would be required for the 332 project guys, for example, once they're affordably able to read as input, the current AFR. So there ya go, two mingled and possibly fruitful topics: (1) Q: any way to move those useful and inexpensive OEM controllers into the realm of WOT closed-loop ECU, once affordable AFR sensing becomes available, and (2) Q: what kind of interesting controller phenom do you get into if you're actually building your own controller from scratch, have access to the code, and want to equip it to run closed-loop WOT via wideband O2 sensing. Might also be revealing to hear from anyone with the wideband option on a FelPro controller, explain any interesting programming additions (like new modes or parameters), that are necessary for bringing up one of these controllers on an engine. Anyone with a FP controller with the wideband option? Gar - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe from diy_efi, send "unsubscribe diy_efi" (without the quotes) in the body of a message (not the subject) to majordomo@xxx.org ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 31 Mar 2000 13:22:59 -0600 From: "John C." Subject: Re: Affordable Wideband ECUs - How to? I have the FelPro controller with wideband o2. I will be setting it up on my twin turbo Baracuda next month. > > Might also be revealing to hear from anyone with the wideband option on > a FelPro controller, explain any interesting programming additions (like > new modes or parameters), that are necessary for bringing up one of > these controllers on an engine. Anyone with a FP controller with the > wideband option? > > Gar > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- - -- > To unsubscribe from diy_efi, send "unsubscribe diy_efi" (without the quotes) > in the body of a message (not the subject) to majordomo@xxx.org > > - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe from diy_efi, send "unsubscribe diy_efi" (without the quotes) in the body of a message (not the subject) to majordomo@xxx.org ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 31 Mar 2000 11:54:38 -0800 From: garwillis@xxx.com (Garfield Willis) Subject: Re: Affordable Wideband ECUs - How to? On Fri, 31 Mar 2000 13:22:59 -0600, "John C." wrote: >I have the FelPro controller with wideband o2. I will be setting it up on my >twin turbo Baracuda next month. Excellent. When you get some time to go thru the manual and want to discuss what you find there, especially regarding anything unique to the wideband setup, I'd love to hear about it, as I'm sure others would too. One question for you: let's see if we can ID the actual NTK variant of the sensor they've supplied you. First, tell me if you would, how many rings of holes you see on the sides of the cylindrical protruding end of your sensor: one or two? What I mean by that is, do you find gas entry holes around the sensor tip in one circumferential line of holes or two? Gar - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe from diy_efi, send "unsubscribe diy_efi" (without the quotes) in the body of a message (not the subject) to majordomo@xxx.org ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 31 Mar 2000 15:33:57 -0500 From: Scott Knight Subject: Re: Affordable Wideband ECUs - How to? > >I have the FelPro controller with wideband o2. I will be setting it up on my > >twin turbo Baracuda next month. > > Excellent. When you get some time to go thru the manual and want to > discuss what you find there, especially regarding anything unique to the > wideband setup, I'd love to hear about it, as I'm sure others would too. > > One question for you: let's see if we can ID the actual NTK variant of > the sensor they've supplied you. First, tell me if you would, how many > rings of holes you see on the sides of the cylindrical protruding end of > your sensor: one or two? What I mean by that is, do you find gas entry > holes around the sensor tip in one circumferential line of holes or two? Hey! Finally something I can contribute to here. I have had my FP box running on the racecar very happily with the wideband. The sensor I have has stamped on the sheetmetal where the 5 wires go in: L1H1 NTK JAPAN and on the wrench flat: 6Y13 and the part that goes into the exhaust stream has a single ring of 6 holes plus 1 in the end. Does this do any good? >From the software side, there is not much that you do to enable the wideband. Basically, a checkbox turns it on. The adjustments are High RPM, Low RPM, Cold and Hot Closed Loop Delay (in sec), Closed Loop Gain (%), Max Closed Loop Step (%), Min Temp (º). Beyond that are only the A/F ratio table and some correction limits. Unfortunately, I bought mine early on and didn't get a manual of any kind. If anyone has ANY documentation for this thing, I would appreciate getting to take a look at it. Later dates. - -- Scott Knight mailto:scott@xxx.com http://www.scottknight.com/ IRC:SS396man '95 Black Impala SS '94 Ducati 900SS CR - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe from diy_efi, send "unsubscribe diy_efi" (without the quotes) in the body of a message (not the subject) to majordomo@xxx.org ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 31 Mar 2000 12:44:08 -0800 From: "John Dammeyer" Subject: Re: DIY_EFI Digest V5 #131 Hi, I don't remember where I found the Al Grippo document nor what his email address is but what I have done is posted the document on my WEB page under the documents link. It's the only one there at the moment. One of these days I'll add other documents of interest. www.autoartisans.com Cheers, John > ------------------------------ > > Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 23:45:54 PST > From: "mike mager" > Subject: Re: 8051 Code > > Greetings! > > I searched around for Al Grippo code and for Al Lipper code, with no result; > how could I find it? Circuit Cellar I have, and that's what starterd my > interest in a DIY system. > > Thanks, > Mike - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe from diy_efi, send "unsubscribe diy_efi" (without the quotes) in the body of a message (not the subject) to majordomo@xxx.org ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 31 Mar 2000 13:43:25 -0700 From: Chad Subject: Re: Affordable Wideband ECUs - How to? >There was some discussion early on, and then later some also in private >amongst a couple of us, about the possibility of programming an OEM >controller like the GM ECUs to force it to stay in closed-loop even at >high TPS and load, and trick the controller by mimicing the >stoich-crossing to occur at whatever AFR you chose. This was essentially >the idea of simulating the stoich-crossing input to the OEM controller, >and use an EGOR module (or an NTK box, or whatever) to allow "moving" >this simulated stoich-crossing to whatever AFR you commanded. Bruce >Plecan and some of his GN/GM buddies apparently looked into it, and >decided there likely wasn't enough "authority" in the tables that could >be reprogrammed, to keep the controller forced into closed-loop, and >gave the idea a miss, suggesting that you really needed to get at the >code to do it right. But coaxing those extremely affordable OEM >controllers to make the transition to WOT closed-loop controllers sure >sounds like a wholesome grail worth somemore pursuit, purely from an >economics standpoint. I have a unit up and running right now that does exactly that, allow the user to change the stoich point that the O2 sensor reports. It works quite well, and you can watch the A/F change as buttons to rich/lean are pushed. The flaw in getting the ECU to continually run in closed loop is that this is only manipulating a control input. In effect, you are *asking* the ecu to change the pulse width to the injectors rather than forcing it to run in a certain way. The changes only occur at idle and cruise, when the ecu is paying attention to the O2 signal input. With the experimenting I've done, I agree that you need to have more authority (source code) in order to force the ecu to do what you want it to. - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe from diy_efi, send "unsubscribe diy_efi" (without the quotes) in the body of a message (not the subject) to majordomo@xxx.org ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 31 Mar 2000 13:28:48 -0800 From: garwillis@xxx.com (Garfield Willis) Subject: Re: Affordable Wideband ECUs - How to? On Fri, 31 Mar 2000 15:33:57 -0500, Scott Knight wrote: >Hey! Finally something I can contribute to here. I have had my FP box >running on the racecar very happily with the wideband. The sensor I >have has stamped on the sheetmetal where the 5 wires go in: > > L1H1 >NTK JAPAN > >and on the wrench flat: > >6Y13 Moto bene! Actually, they all say L1H1, whether the "normal" direct-from-NTK, or the Honda-NTK sensor. The direct-NTK will have a "CSS0xxx" engraved on the sensor cuff as well. >and the part that goes into the exhaust stream has a single ring of 6 >holes plus 1 in the end. > >Does this do any good? Ahh yup, that's almost certainly a Honda-NTK sensor! The NTK-direct sensors have a set of two rings of staggered holes. Does yours have the original grey plastic Honda connector on it perhaps, with the cal resistor molded into the plug? If so, measuring the cal resistor will tell you if you've got a sensor they bought from Honda. They've probably removed the Honda connector, tho. Heh heh, I had suspected this, but just wasn't sure. NTK themselves is reported to be about to obsolete their older sensor and blue box, and come out with a *non-compatible* newer sensor and box. I'm just wondering if they as well will roll over to these later sensors, and in effect unify the entire NTK sensor line. Just curious, for someone with a manual, do they spell out a free-air calibration step for the sensor? Be sad if they haven't taken advantage of that. >From the software side, there is not much that you do to enable the >wideband. Basically, a checkbox turns it on. The adjustments are High >RPM, Low RPM, Cold and Hot Closed Loop Delay (in sec), Closed Loop Gain >(%), Max Closed Loop Step (%), Min Temp (º). Beyond that are only the >A/F ratio table and some correction limits. Great, now all we need is someone with a later one, and a manual, and can also see any revs/changes they've done from the above nicely simple setup to the current one (maybe still just the same; I'm not hinting at something I know, I don't know squat about the FelPro box). Interesting they control the slew-rate of the fuel servo via a max step size. That's pretty conservative an approach. That's a good start. Gives more credence and confidence to others that given the wideband interface (EGOR or NTK or ??; but something cheap please :), and a controller mangled or designed to use it, that WOT-closed-loop control is suddenly about to become very affordable AND prevalent, so we'll have many more experimenters discussing and perfecting it. Interesting times. Gar - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe from diy_efi, send "unsubscribe diy_efi" (without the quotes) in the body of a message (not the subject) to majordomo@xxx.org ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 31 Mar 2000 16:44:28 -0500 From: Scott Knight Subject: Re: Affordable Wideband ECUs - How to? Garfield, > sensors have a set of two rings of staggered holes. Does yours have the > original grey plastic Honda connector on it perhaps, with the cal > resistor molded into the plug? If so, measuring the cal resistor will > tell you if you've got a sensor they bought from Honda. Actually, there is an 8-place (4+4) rectangular gray connector with 7 terminals. The 5 wires seem to directly go to 5 of the terminals, while the other 2 terminals are above a square block part of the connector. Very obviously the resistor, and it measures out to real near 10k ohms. This sounds like it must have the Honda connector to me... Later dates. - -- Scott Knight mailto:scott@xxx.com http://www.scottknight.com/ IRC:SS396man '95 Black Impala SS '94 Ducati 900SS CR - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe from diy_efi, send "unsubscribe diy_efi" (without the quotes) in the body of a message (not the subject) to majordomo@xxx.org ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 31 Mar 2000 13:56:27 -0800 From: garwillis@xxx.com (Garfield Willis) Subject: Re: Affordable Wideband ECUs - How to? On Fri, 31 Mar 2000 16:44:28 -0500, Scott Knight wrote: >Actually, there is an 8-place (4+4) rectangular gray connector with 7 >terminals. The 5 wires seem to directly go to 5 of the terminals, while >the other 2 terminals are above a square block part of the connector. >Very obviously the resistor, and it measures out to real near 10k ohms. >This sounds like it must have the Honda connector to me... Yup that's it, and the cal resistor is well within the range of Honda-NTK sensors, but also most definitely *outside* the range of an NTK-direct sensor. Bingo. Gar - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe from diy_efi, send "unsubscribe diy_efi" (without the quotes) in the body of a message (not the subject) to majordomo@xxx.org ------------------------------ End of DIY_EFI Digest V5 #132 ***************************** To subscribe to DIY_EFI-Digest, send the command: subscribe diy_efi-digest in the body of a message to "Majordomo@xxx. A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to subscribe to that instead, replace "diy_efi-digest" in the command above with "diy_efi".